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September 4, 2007 Tape # 018 & 019

The White County Drainage Board convened at 10:30 A.M. in the Commissioners’ Room of the White County Building, Monticello, Indiana with Board Members Ronald Schmierer, John C. Heimlich and Steve Burton, Attorney George W. Loy, Surveyor Dennis Sterrett, Drainage Assistant Mary Sterrett and Secretary Jamie Rozzi in attendance.


Charlie Mellon and John Warner were also in attendance.


Chairman Schmierer opened the meeting asking for approval of the minutes for the August 20, 2007 meeting. Board Member Burton so moved. Board Member Heimlich seconded the motion. The minutes were approved unanimously.

The next item on the agenda is the Hearing on the Vacation of the J. M. Timmons Branch #5 and Branch #1 of Branch #5 Drains. Chairman Schmierer, “I’m surprised that if you sent out stuff to have a hearing on it that there is no one here, aren’t you? It is Smolek’s, that’s what you’re talking about, right?”


“Yes,” Surveyor Sterrett replied.


“Everyone has been notified about it?” Chairman Schmierer asked.


“Yes, everyone has been notified. There were five landowners: Lorene Miller, Richard Ploss, James Schmitz, Raymond Smolek and Richard Wells,” Surveyor Sterrett replied.


“And no one has commented on it?” Chairman Schmierer continued.


“No, in fact…” Surveyor Sterrett replied.


“I thought sure that Ploss would be in it,” Chairman Schmierer added.


“Ploss signed the petition to vacate. It just goes up and barely goes into his ground up in the northeast corner. This tile is a legal drain, but it is not on maintenance. Everything has been re-tiled away from it, which is probably why no one cares about it,” Surveyor Sterrett replied.


Attorney Loy stated, “No remonstrances or objections?”


“No,” Surveyor Sterrett replied. “It’s the easiest one we’ve had in a while,” Chairman Schmierer added. Chairman Schmierer then read the following:


















“Actually, there is no maintenance fund for that drain,” Surveyor Sterrett stated.


“I didn’t believe that there was,” Chairman Schmierer replied.


The next item on the agenda is Clapper Funeral Home (Monon) Drainage Review. Clapper Funeral Home is located east of Monon on State Road 16. The school is over here and the church is located right in here and then there is farm field and this is Hites’ Vet place on the east side. Todd (Frauhiger) has looked at Clapper’s Drainage Plan and there was some concern with the outlet size, but he said after he worked up the computations on it that the pond at a 100-year storm will have a 6 inch free board on it, based on using this swale that is draining the parking lot. The parking lot will drain off into the swale, down to the detention pond, and then there is an 8 inch tile running down here and down to a 24 inch storm sewer that the town of Monon put in. The question came up of whether or not Clapper’s should have an easement across here. Mr. Milligan has prepared an easement running from Hites’ property west to the church’s property 15 feet wide. It was discovered later that Hites’ has a forced main sewer that runs into town already. He already had an easement, but Clapper did not have an easement. The legal description has been prepared, but the easement has not been recorded yet.


Surveyor Sterrett stated, “I would say that the plan is ready to be approved, according to Todd, contingent on getting the easement across Brown’s property.”


Chairman Schmierer asked, “Will that easement to the church be far enough?”


“Yes, the existing manhole for the storm sewer is east of the church. We just needed it to the manhole, but the town evidently wants to acquire this easement also.” Surveyor Sterrett replied. “They are going to run water out there and this storm sewer is going to run into it. They will probably run water out to Hites’ because they don’t have city water. So, the town wants the easement for expansion.” Surveyor Sterrett continued.


“Obviously they want to get moving on this, but if the town goes by in front of them, they wouldn’t need the easement,” Board Member Burton stated.


“If the town acquires the easement and makes it a public easement, then he wouldn’t need an easement.” Surveyor Sterrett stated.


“However, he (Clapper) wants to get started quicker than waiting for the town.” Board Member Burton added.


Surveyor Sterrett continued, “We had held him up two weeks. It is ready for approval contingent upon the easement being recorded.” Surveyor Sterrett stated.


“I would move that we approve the drainage review for Clapper Funeral Home (Monon) contingent upon the easement for the outlet being recorded,” stated Board Member Heimlich. Board Member Burton seconded the motion. The motion carries unanimously for approval of the drainage review for Clapper Funeral Home (Monon).


The next item on the agenda was a continuation of the discussion of the Esther Fraser Ditch. Chairman Schmierer was absent at the last meeting. Board Member Heimlich stated, “I will have to excuse myself from voting on this because I am a landowner on the Fraser.”


“What do we have left to do on the Fraser?” Chairman Schmierer asked.


“What we have left is to approve the maintenance project. If you want to know anything, I can show you,” Surveyor Sterrett replied.


“I read the minutes. I don’t think I need to know anything further,” Chairman Schmierer stated.


“The project will start up here at Honey Creek and run 8.25 miles down to where it ends here.” stated Surveyor Sterrett.


Chairman Schmierer entertained a motion to approve the Esther Fraser Maintenance Project. Board Member Burton so moved. Chairman Schmierer seconded the motion. The motion carried unanimously.


Next on the agenda is Dwyer in Wolcott. Surveyor Sterrett received a phone call from Dwyer Instruments stating that there was a hole in a tile that is located underneath their parking lot. Surveyor Sterrett went out and took pictures of the hole. It is not a big deal yet, but he called last week and said that it wasn’t getting any bigger. Surveyor Sterrett wanted to bring this to the attention of the Drainage Board. It probably is over the tile, but we have to watch it that it doesn’t suck because the blacktop will stay there, but it may suck the gravel off of it.

“Is that the tile that goes out north?” Board Member Heimlich asked.


“Yes, the one that we’ve had problems with before. We should probably go in and fix it right away,” Chairman Schmierer stated.


Surveyor Sterrett replied, “I told him we could do that. Do you think we should?”


“You don’t know what it’s doing underneath that blacktop….they’ve been having problems with tile,” Board Member Heimlich stated.


Chairman Schmierer continued, “I think you should go ahead and have it fixed.”


“I just wasn’t sure because it is such a small hole, right now it just goes straight down like it might have a wide joint. Ok, I will get someone over there to fix it,” Surveyor Sterrett replied.


“If it washes out underneath that blacktop then we will have bigger problems,” Chairman Schmierer added.


The next item to address is the Victor Tile (Brookston). Mr. Burton has been there and I (Surveyor Sterrett) took some pictures. Surveyor Sterrett explained that the air well was located about 20 feet from the tree and then the tile runs toward the south and runs up and across the fence line. I don’t know exactly where at. It comes from the north, cuts across the fence because there is an air well on it over there on Hall’s property, goes across ST RD 18 clear on down into Lehe’s,” Surveyor Sterrett explained.


Surveyor Sterrett explained where the tile is, “I think it goes across the fence before the dirt to the south. I’m not sure.”


Board Member Burton explained, “Attorney Loy, in reference earlier about the tile where the dirt is piled from here to the north. Obviously, he is not within the 75 feet…”


“That is for drain maintenance, but ok,” stated Attorney Loy.


Board Member Burton continued, “Now, as the tile heads up, the dirt piled up is within the 75 feet.”

“It is within the watershed of the Victor Tile. I think what’s more important is whether it is in the watershed,” stated Attorney Loy.


“We saw the last picture of this dirt…now this is to the north. We are assuming the tile is right in that area,” Board Member Burton stated.


“Mr. Warner, who is in attendance, said that there is probably a private tile that is probably coming in here right under that dirt. We are not certain of that though,” Surveyor Sterrett stated.


“Back over in this cornfield is an air well on the section line,” Surveyor Sterrett continued.


“Who owns the land that the piles of dirt are on?” Attorney Loy asked.


Surveyor Sterrett replied, “Mr. Jacobs. Mr. Jacobs has been stopped from dumping more dirt there by IDEM because it is contaminated.” Surveyor Sterrett then showed photos of how Mr. Jacobs is accessing the site and also where the tile runs in that photo.


Chairman Schmierer stated, “We’ve had enough trouble with that tile anyhow from time to time.”


“I guess the question is can he pile dirt out there?” Surveyor Sterrett asked.


Attorney Loy replied, “Well, in my opinion, if it’s contaminated soil and it is within the watershed of our drain, we have jurisdiction to do something about it if we want to, I assume we do. Do you have a copy of the IDEM order?”


“No, this has all been through John Raines.” Surveyor Sterrett stated.


Board Member Burton added, “There was one issued Friday. I think that was the first time I had seen anything on paper. We will get a hold of John; hopefully John is down there this morning.”


“Did you see it?” Surveyor Sterrett asked of Board Member Burton.


Board Member Burton replied, “I was at the meeting on Friday.”


“It is definitely in the watershed. We don’t know if it’s in the right-of-way?” Board Member Heimlich asked.


“I think maybe one corner of it is, not knowing exactly where the tile is.” Surveyor Sterrett replied.


“You can somewhat guess…I didn’t realize there was an air well up there. Is it in Hall’s fence row or out in the field? I thought it was closer to the fence line and that would be more obvious,” Board Member Burton continued.


“The one question I have been asked many times in the last two weeks is...the surrounding ground is low area also. The ground on this side is as low or maybe a little lower. The concern is…and the houses to the south are similar…if he fills that in, that water is obviously going to run off toward them. The question being thrown to me is does the Drainage Board have a dog in this fight with the water running onto the neighbors without some kind of drainage plan or since they are actually not building and just moving dirt…” Board Member Burton explained.


Board Member Heimlich continued, “I think the question of whether it is something that comes to us is part of a civil dispute or whether, since it is in the watershed of the county drain, whether we have jurisdiction over someone doing that.”


Attorney Loy explained, “I think we definitely have jurisdiction because it is within the watershed of the drain. I think we could have jurisdiction if the landowner brought a private action to us via that other...”


“I knew we could do that, but since it is a county regulated drain, if somebody is changing the way the water, the contour of the land…” stated Board Member Heimlich.


“Well, yeah, that too, but the contaminants definitely gives us the right to stop that. I think we should coordinate efforts with IDEM. I would like to see that IDEM order and see who the contact person is,” added Attorney Loy.


“If they follow through, the soil samples are supposed to be taken today. They said it should be 6-7 days before they know the results, in order to find out the condition of that ground that he has hauled up there. Whether it’s industrial contaminants or whatever…From IDEM’s standpoint there was no plan to the future until they understood what the results of the soil testing,” Board Member Burton stated.


Chairman Schmierer stated, “Well, IDEM has him on hold for present anyhow.”


“You can’t see it, but he does have a silt fence there,” Surveyor Sterrett pointed out.


“Did he put up the orange plastic fencing?” Board Member Heimlich asked.


“I think he was required because…anything you see up there was part of the requirements to…and see, this picture is old. The updated version now is that there is a second plastic to the south of the original pile. The north pile does not have any underlayment and he has been told that he has to pull that dirt back, put an underlayment, then lay the dirt back over and cover it up. There is currently a pile, not quite as big, to the south of that…that had he put underlayment under it and what he hauled last Tuesday and Wednesday is there plus it is covered. So, there is twice as much dirt there,” Board Member Burton explained.


“Is this outside the town limits?” Attorney Loy asked.


“It is in the town limits, but it’s A-1,” replied Board Member Burton.


Board Member Burton explained a photo that he took that showed the water down there that smelled like gas and you can see the hose to the pump over there on the back side of the picture, where the hose is going up through the dirt pumping it out on the city street.


“Yeah, it was ponding there by the curb. That was one that IDEM told Mr. Jacobs that if he pumped anything off site in liquid you go to jail,” Board Member Burton continued.


“There are many questions on our side right now. My biggest thing of bringing this up today is all the people calling and saying where does the Drainage Board stand on this and whether we do something now or wait until he moves,” stated Board Member Burton.


Attorney Loy stated, “I recommend getting a hold of IDEM and letting them know of our concerns and also to send some sort of correspondence that we have in the file that we notified him that this is within the Victor Tile watershed and to cease dumping any further fill from this site or any other contaminated site he might have. I’ll help you draft it.”


“As he is digging the dirt out, the water is running in. It isn’t running from the top of the ground, it’s in the ground,” Board Member Burton stated.


Surveyor Sterrett asked, “Why is he digging that out, because of the contaminated soil?”


“Yes, he has to get rid of it,” Attorney Loy replied.


“As you drive by there now, when Max shut him down and John Raines called IDEM; IDEM called him and told him to shut down and that he couldn’t move, he continued to dig and the dirt that you see in this property that is covered up with plastic he pulled out and he was hauling stone and other fill back in, which now you don’t see the water because in that day’s time he filled that back in,” Board Member Burton explained.


“After he was told not to (fill it back in)?” Chairman Schmierer asked.


Board Member Burton continued, “Well, he couldn’t remove anything, but he didn’t know that he couldn’t bring...So they have him stopped to where he can’t move anything on the property, at least until…I didn’t pay as much attention to that property as this issue here what he could and could not do.”


“Any way of sampling what is coming out of the Victor Tile at the outlet or further downstream?” Attorney Loy asked.


Board Member Burton explained, “He has hired a company…I’m not sure of the technical term of this…The plan was laid out Friday, and John Raines was there, that they will test the air well above it, the air well on his property, and below it and if anything shows up there will be a record of it.”


“So they are going to test the outlet?” Surveyor Sterrett asked.


“They are testing upstream and downstream,” Board Member Burton explained.


“Where is the outlet?” Attorney Loy asked.


Chairman Schmierer replied, “It goes clear down to Moot’s Creek. It goes across State Road 18, down through Lehe’s property.”


Board Member Burton stated, “I’m not sure whether they are going to clear to Moot’s Creek or try to pick it up over by Lopp’s somewhere. I’m not sure downstream where they are going to test. To be fair to Mr. Jacobs, they thought it would be fair to go up out north of it to find out what it is entering his property.”


More discussion on the location of the Victor Tile….please see tape for further information.


“The company is to address any run-off. This guy was basically hired last Thursday or Friday. If there is any significant amount he is to get in touch with or should be up there under orders that they physically pump water off of the site so it doesn’t go into the tile, but that’s a big change between what was happening and all of a sudden,” Board Member Burton explained.


“Ok, I guess for now that has somewhere answered our questions, any additions John (Warner)?” Board Member Burton asked.


“No, I guess we will just have to wait on that report,” John Warner stated.


Board Member Burton continued, “The soil testing will make a big difference. If it comes back and that ground is really hot, it creates a better leverage point that the ground leaves. If it comes back and it’s residential contaminated then IDEM is going to be a little friendlier, because it’s no different than what is by your house, then our leverage.”


“What about the amount of dirt he has hauled in there? Has it changed the run-off of surface water to adversely affect one person or another?” Board Member Heimlich asked.


“I would say it has changed the volume of what it used to hold. That is kind of a bowl down there that held water and it drained away eventually,” Surveyor Sterrett replied.


“And he’s filling it in,” Chairman Schmierer added.


“That is my question; if he puts good soil in there can he continue to fill that in?” Surveyor Sterrett asked.


“So long as it’s not obstructing a natural waterway, and it’s not. I don’t think there’s a problem there. He has a right to fill in his own hole.” Attorney Loy stated.


“As long as he’s not blocking the water or causing it to back up on someone else,” Board Member Heimlich added.


John Warner asked, “What if he levels that off and that dirt is ok? What happens then?”


Attorney Loy questioned, “Levels off what he’s dumped there and the dirt’s fine?”


Board Member Heimlich replied, “Well, that is basically that is what we are talking about, if he’s not blocking water or backing it up on someone else…”


“When we get a big rain though, there is a lot of water goes that way,” John Warner stated. Surveyor Sterrett agreed.


“He is not obligated to maintain a drainage hole or pond. He has a right to level it off,” Attorney Loy stated.


“But is he diverting it from where it would go otherwise?” Board Member Heimlich questioned.


Chairman Schmierer stated, “That has always been a problem back in there. We have fought that tile for some time.”


“Again, that is where the landowners around there are asking me if that falls under the Drainage Board, or like John said, does that become a civil issue?” Board Member Burton asked.


Attorney Loy explained, “Well, it is a civil issue that reaches us, or could reach us eventually. It would be up to the individual landowner to do something about it. If they feel it is rerouting a natural drainage water course or just changing the general topography…”


“So, do they need to pursue civil and bring it to the Drainage Board or do they need to come to us with their concerns?” Board Member Burton asked.


“We can advise you as to what the alternatives are, but again, if there is a natural water course that runs through his property and he is damming it up and it’s backing water up on you or running it off over here, that’s one thing…but just filling in a hole so the water…He is not obligated to maintain a drainage pond on his own property, if that is what that is, or was. The law does not keep every landowner from ever touching or filling in their land,” Attorney Loy explained.


“I think that has basically been a detention pond type thing,” Chairman Schmierer stated.


Attorney Loy continued, “I don’t think he’s obligated to keep that.”


The next item on the agenda is the Sluyter Ditch. It is located in Liberty Township, up by Buffalo. Surveyor Sterrett explained, “The ditch comes up through the lot line, goes up through here, and empties into the river. Anna C. Harrington-Need. The wind has taken down a couple trees that are in this ditch and we are right at the end of the legal description of it. The open ditch runs through the lot line. She owns the trailer here and the trees have fallen down right in here. It is all brushy in there. I guess I am bringing it to the board to see if we can go ahead and take the trees out. I have some pictures.”


“Where that is brushy, is that still the regulated drain?” Chairman Schmierer asked.


Surveyor Sterrett replied, “Yes. Her trailer sits over here. The ditch is right here on the other side of this boat. This tree limb has fallen down on top of the shed. There is the limb, part of it broke off and went this way and the other part went to the right and fell on the shed. It is a pretty good size limb.”


“Is there money in that fund?” Board Member Heimlich asked.


Surveyor Sterrett replied, “Yes.”


“I think you and I have been up there before, haven’t we?” Chairman Schmierer asked.


“We were up there to remove some trees. Alan Howe was up there working, and she called us, and we went up there and removed some trees. I think Alan took some of the logs and left the brush there. I think they burnt the brush right there on the site, right next to the mobile home. There is $3,000.00 in the fund right now. Right after I was finished here I went over to look at another ditch and Mike Ezra was over there. He know Ms. Harrington-Need and said that he would take the trees out for her when we were ready,” Surveyor Sterrett explained.


“I don’t see any reason not to, do you? Go ahead and get it done,” Chairman Schmierer stated.


“It is kind of blocking the ditch right now.” Surveyor Sterrett explained.


The next item on the agenda is the Denton-Culp Branch. Surveyor Sterrett, explained, “Mike Ezra is up there dipping out…it is a Jasper County drain. The Denton Drain is a Jasper County Drain. I don’t have any photos of it, but Todd from Richel Enterprises/Overmeyer, west of Monon, had this ditch dipped out on his own. Not our ditch, but Jasper County’s ditch. So, there is a branch that comes into the Denton Ditch, called the Denton-Culp Branch. Mike has his excavator up there now. Todd from Richel wanted to know if we could help him out dipping part of the ditch out. They want to dip the branch at 500 West (3,700 feet). I asked Ezra how much he would do it for and he said $1,200.00.”


“Does that branch pay maintenance? Is it all together or how does it work?” Board Member Heimlich asked.


“The branch is by itself and it is on maintenance. There is $9,478 in the fund and we haven’t collected on it since 2000. It brings in $2,000 from White County and $360 from Jasper County. It brings in $2,360 per year. It is seven tenths of a mile,” Surveyor Sterrett replied.


“Why would that branch bring in an assessment from Jasper County?” Board Member Heimlich asked.


“There is some ground that comes across here. I think there is another ditch that empties into that,” Surveyor Sterrett replied.


“It is almost 4,000 feet for $1,200.00. I couldn’t believe that,” Surveyor Sterrett explained.


“Wouldn’t we have to have approval from Jasper County in order to do that because they are being assessed?” Board Member Heimlich asked.


Surveyor Sterrett replied, “It is maintenance, to me its maintenance.”


“The ditch is all in the White County, but the assessment is not, but we control the maintenance fund?” Board Member Burton asked.


“Yes, just like Jasper County controls the maintenance fund on this. Todd from Richel Enterprises told me that Jasper County was going to do something over here on their part, but not doing anything in White County. Richel Enterprises owns quite a bit of ground around there,” Surveyor Sterrett explained.


“What is the favor of the board? Do we want to go ahead and get that done while he is up there?” asked Chairman Schmierer.


Board Member so moved to make a motion to approve maintenance on the Denton Culp Branch. Board Member seconded the motion. Motion was made and seconded to clean the Denton Culp for 3,700 feet. Motion carried unanimously.


The Buffalo Fire Department called the Surveyor’s Office; they have been having a drainage problem in front of the department. Surveyor Sterrett explained, “The drain goes across the road, comes down, and goes over to the catch basin. As far as I can tell, from looking at records, is that it is a private tile. They are having problems with it. The regulated drain only goes from the catch basin to the river. I suggested that they contact the State Highway. They contacted the County Highway and the County came up and jetted the drain both ways. They got across the road and hit the T. So, they quit. The County Highway suggested that they call the State Highway. The State Highway must have come right out there and they jetted 200 feet from the air well down this way and they went into the county drain and jetted back toward the highway and stopped about 47 feet from the catch basin and stopped because they couldn’t go any further.”


“They were jetting from the air well east?” Board Member Burton asked.


“Evidently, the drains that come from Buffalo come down here somehow and get into the concrete box and the water has been ponding over by the fire department. There is an air well here, and air well on this side and I don’t know where they go or go across,” Surveyor Sterrett explained.


“Is that school blacktop where you’re at now? Is their blacktop over our tile?” Board Member Burton asked.


“I don’t know whether it’s the cemetery’s blacktop or the school’s. This is a private tile from what I can find in the records. The fire department is asking me what we can do.” Surveyor Sterrett asked.


“It is a private tile. I don’t think we have any jurisdiction to do anything on private tile,” Board Member Heimlich stated.


“I looked up the minutes on it to see if I could find anything. Back in 80’s, the county donated $1,000 to fix the some of the tile. They took the money from the county highway funds,” Surveyor Sterrett explained.


“That is when they put in the catch basin right west of the fire station before you get to the Highway 39,” Charlie Mellon added.


Surveyor Sterrett stated, “That drain has $216.00 in it. It is paid up.”


“I wonder why that was even made a legal drain in the first place, that short place to the river,” Board Member Heimlich questioned.


“They must have been having trouble with it and the school was having trouble, so they petitioned to make it a regulated drain,” Surveyor Sterrett explained.


“Who else is on it?” Board Member Heimlich asked.


Surveyor Sterrett explained, “The people in Buffalo are being assessed, the ones on the private.”


Chairman Schmierer stated, “I don’t see a thing that we can do for them.”


Board Member Heimlich added, “If they were being assessed on it, then why didn’t they make the whole thing regulated. That is what I don’t understand. Without it being regulated, I don’t know how we can do anything about it.”


The legal description starts from the Southwest Corner of Lot 38 and goes west to the river. It doesn’t mention anything about any other tiles east of there.


“It is still private. They will have to take care of it on their own,” Chairman Schmierer stated.


“Who takes the responsibility for that then? Does the fire department, the town, the trustee?” Surveyor Sterrett asked.


“If you would like me to speak with the township trustee, Walt, I can do that." Attorney Loy said.


“Well, it’s the fire department. Walt might want to do it himself. The only other thing they could do…” Chairman Schmierer added.


“For us to do it they would have to petition to get the whole thing regulated. They probably want it to be fixed faster than that would happen,” Board Member Burton added.


Attorney Loy added, “Surveyor Sterrett and I can call Walt.”


“I don’t know if the fire department has contacted Walt or not. I know they contacted me, then they contacted the County Highway, and then they contacted the State Highway and that was it.” Surveyor Sterrett stated.


The last item on the agenda is VeraSun. VeraSun has emailed me the plans for the railroad siding and I have since went out and located and tried to plot the Holcomb Tile on their railroad plans. Surveyor Sterrett then showed a plan of where he plotted the tile on VeraSun’s proposed siding connection.


“Their siding is going to connect that far south. I thought they were going to be north farther,” Board Member Heimlich stated.


Surveyor Sterrett added, “That is what everyone thought.”


“Their sighting is going to go right over that Holcomb Tile," added Board Member Heimlich.


“This is just based on…they didn’t give me much to work with and the only thing I had was the distance from the CSX track. I scaled and measured it and found out where the tile was in relation to the siding. I plotted the buildings in their…this is my drawing. So, this is based on a scale distance of 200 scale from here to the CSX track and I have emailed this to HDR,” Surveyor Sterrett stated.


“What are they proposing to do? The only thing I have heard is that they want to run a tile along the outside of the loop,” Board Member Heimlich asked.


Surveyor Sterrett showed where VeraSun had the Holcomb Tile on their drawings. “Let’s go through what they have emailed to me. There is the end of the 10 inch drain tile and I believe that this green line is also a 10 inch,” Surveyor Sterrett explained.


“Is that the 10 inch tile that was to drain the detention pond?” Board Member Heimlich asked.


Surveyor Sterrett explained, “No, this is sub-surface drainage. This other tile to the left is planned. The one to the right is also tile I believe.”


Surveyor Sterrett continued, “It looks like they are all coming up here to a 10 inch T, so that is a 10 inch tile, and come over here and then they want to run a 12 inch to the ditch.”


Board Member Burton asked, “So they are not asking to go into the Holcomb Tile?”


“No, they are asking to go into the Fraser,” Surveyor Sterrett replied.


“When Charlie first talked to me he talked about hooking into the Holcomb Tile to try and solve some of the problems on that side of town along with what they were doing here and I said I didn’t know that we would have to see the plans to see if that was possible,” stated Board Member Heimlich.


“The dashed line is the outlet to their detention pond. There is the outlet, so they are not running these tiles into the detention pond,” explained Surveyor Sterrett.


Board Member Heimlich replied, “No, but I guess I don’t understand this second line to the left. The other is following the loop all the way around. What is the second one? Is it because it’s in that swale of the existing railroad? Are they making sure that they are draining that? They didn’t say anything about the Holcomb, did they?”


“Yes, B. J. the project engineer started to say something about it, and then he said they weren’t going to hook into it now. They must have been talking about it at one time,” Surveyor Sterrett replied.


“But they are not talking about helping out the town at all either,” commented Board Member Heimlich.


“No,” answered Surveyor Sterrett. “Here is another thing they are going to do up at the north end. They are going to install laterals for sub-surface drainage. They are running it over and running it into the 12 inch also, or the 10 inch. I think that is the manhole that this other drain runs into.”


Board Member Heimlich added, “None of this tile will have any catch basins or air wells, right?”


Surveyor Sterrett explained, “No, everything from the site will still drain into the detention pond...the surface water. This is what Mike, from HDR, emailed me this morning after I sent him information on where the Holcomb Tile was. I questioned how much water he was planning to dump into the Esther Fraser. His reply to my email stated the following:


  1. The 18 inch tile will replace the existing 12 inch tile being used now, which is the detention pond. This has been approved by the county already as part of the storm detention pond discharge. It will likely be put in under the current construction work going on now as opposed to the next phase of construction.


  1. The 10 inch tile, this line discharges the water draining from the site tile drain system installed earlier this summer. The county had given the OK for VeraSun to temporarily discharge the drainage into the Fraser Ditch for construction purposes. (That was for when they were boring those holes.) VeraSun would like to make that drainage permanent. They estimate their discharge at about 100 gallons per minutes of ground water.


  1. Also, 6 inch tile forced main. This line is a back-up to the 10 inch tile drain above. In the event of hydrolic conditions that do not allow gravity discharge, a pumping station can pump 180 gallons per minutes through a 6 inch line to the Esther Fraser Ditch. This is intended for use as a back-up system only. 8 inch vinyl; this line is a pump discharge line from the site’s equalization basin which collects the boiler blow down, cooling tower blow down, and water treatment filling reject water. There are no harmful contaminants expected to be present in the water. The purpose of the equalization basin is to cool the water prior to discharging it. Most of the time the flow will be 350 gallons per minutes, but once every month or so, the flow will be as high as 720 gallons per minute.


A drawing will be sent of these penetrations when they are prepared.


“Has Todd (Frauhiger) seen any of this?” Board Member Heimlich asked.


Surveyor Sterrett replied, “I emailed this to him. He is on his way back from Florida so I haven’t got his reaction to any of this yet. SFLECC was concerned with what we were pumping into the ditch. So, they had got a hold of HDR approximately two months ago. HDR replied to them saying that they would be pumping 325 gallons per minutes. I had Todd calculate it and he said that was 2.9 cubic feet per second and the ditch will hold 600 cubic feet per second. So, in total they would be discharging approximately 4 cubic feet per second.”


“At this point we really don’t have the plan, right? I think we would have to wait on that and get Todd’s reaction to that,” Board Member Heimlich stated.


“Going back to where you started, are you asking what to do about the tile being under the railroad tracks?” Board Member Burton asked.


“Yes, I want that protected in case…” Surveyor Sterrett replied.


“That was not the case originally, that rail spur was going to hook further north,” Board Member Heimlich stated.


“That is what I thought,” Surveyor Sterrett replied.


“So, we are going to have to have some sort of agreement on that,” Board Member Heimlich continued.


“We know where the tile is at here because we dug it up. We came down here and dug off of the railroad right of way and found it here. So, we are assuming that it comes up and runs along inside the right of way of the track, the existing right of way of the railroad,” Surveyor Sterrett stated.


“Now that spur is probably going to be right on top of the tile for several feet,” Board Member Heimlich concluded.


“That is what it looks like,” replied Surveyor Sterrett.


“But we have no idea on the depth on the tile they are proposing is, right?” Board Member Burton asked.


“They have an elevation. I don’t know how it compares to the elevation on the Holcomb because we don’t have an elevation on the Holcomb Tile. The rail plans are prepared by some other outfit. I suppose that they will have some rail company construct as well. I emailed this plan that I drew up here to Mike at HDR. The simplest thing to do would probably bet to take it off here and run it up here and then it would just have to be encased under it. I wouldn’t have a problem with that. The tile is not all that deep there, probably 5 of 6 foot deep there,” Surveyor Sterrett stated.


“I think we will have to get more information and see what Todd says about everything,” Board Member Heimlich stated.


Surveyor Sterrett explained, “I also received plans from Kline on 50 East. I haven’t had time to look at those. This is Michael Peterson. I can make a copy of these. He had some issues with some field entrances with whether or not they needed to have right of ways or not. There are field entrances on where the road is going to cross the Diener Ditch. There are some drainage issues on the Kleyla ground, but I haven’t had a chance to look at anything yet. They have a tile that is going to be cut off. VeraSun has agreed to run a 10 or 12 inch tile to take care of some of the highway water where it comes back into VeraSun. Then they had an issue up at the north end of the project and they were afraid that they were going to pond some water on Kleyla. It says, ‘The north end of the new road is located at local low area on the current VeraSun property. Our road side ditches flow through this area due to a very large natural rise from the south. VeraSun seems to indicate that they are temporarily draining this small area of the site to an existing catch basin on the north end of the Kleyla property just east of VeraSun. We are not aware of VeraSun’s plans for the permanent drainage of this area. All of the rough drainage plans you gave us show a natural attenuation area and an outlet control structure here. The private tile in front of Kleyla flows from south to north. If this drain is allowed to receive flows from the road side ditches and the permanent VeraSun site, the pipe or ditch connection will need to be made and catch basin will probably need to be modified. It may be appropriate to provide for detention at this corner of VeraSun’s site to meter the flow down to a small rate. We raised this issue with B. J. Moore with VeraSun a couple of days ago and are awaiting their response.”


Board Member Heimlich stated, “I would like to have a copy of that.”

Surveyor Sterrett added, “This was emailed to me. He also emailed me a copy of the temporary plans. This email was also emailed to Steve Brooke.”


“Do we want to get Todd involved in this project?” Surveyor Sterrett asked.


“The air well that he is talking about that is on the Kleyla property, that is not a county drain, that is a private drain with an air well, correct?” Board Member Heimlich asked.


Surveyor Sterrett replied, “I believe that it is a private drain. Michael Peterson came in last Wednesday or Thursday and we looked at our county drains and he was more concerned about the air well down where it comes into VeraSun and it wasn’t regulated down there.”


Board Member Heimlich asked, “You say there is an area of VeraSun that ponds there now or that is draining down into that air well….,”


“That is what he says,’” Surveyor Sterrett replied.


“How was that handled in their drainage plan?” Board Member Heimlich asked.


Surveyor Sterrett answered, “I don’t know, I looked this morning, but I didn’t see that it was handled. It just says an attenuation area, which means a holding area.”


“I suppose that we should have Todd look at that. He received the overall drainage plans,” Board Member Heimlich said.


“The northeast corner up there of VeraSun is what we are talking about,” Surveyor Sterrett said.


“It is up by that phone thing. We had talked about going farther west with that road to stay away from that phone, because the current plan is not to move that phone hook-up.”


“No, we are going go farther west over and take more of VeraSun’s property where it connects to 100 North. The road will curve to the west right as it….because all of the truck traffic is going to be that way anyway,” Board Member Heimlich explained.


I think that we need to have Todd (Frauhiger) look at it and see what the response is from VeraSun,” continued Board Member Heimlich.


Another item to discuss today is an email that I received from IDEM this morning regarding Mr. Jacobs Windward development. Surveyor Sterrett explained, “The way I read it, sediment laden water was draining from the site into Lake Freeman at the time of the visit. On the big hole, they say that something has to be done. The house needs to be torn down because it is going to fall in. The site is generally rill rutted with gullies of 1 to 3 feet. One gully has grown to an approximate estimated 25 foot wide, 20 feet deep, and 35 feet long present on the south side of the deep excavation area. They said that trees have been falling in and that the house will fall in and it is a matter of time before the silt leaves that hole down there and goes into the lake. Right now the silt is not going in there, but…He needs to provide them with plans and sediment or erosion control.”


Surveyor Sterrett further explained, “Revised development plans were requested in November and received in February of 2007. However, the revised plan did not meet the requirements of Rule 5. No additional revisions or additions to plans or information have been received. The rest of the entire site does not have erosion control, seeding, or mulching evident.”


Chairman Schmierer asked, “Is that all in White County or is part of that in Carroll County?”


“I think most of the run off is going in Carroll County. Some of the run off is running down into that cove where he had spent money to clean it up,” Surveyor Sterrett replied.


“Yes, down there where he put those boat ramps in,” Chairman Schmierer added.

“At this point, IDEM is in charge,” Board Member Burton stated.


“Yes,” Surveyor Sterrett replied.


Lastly, the Surveyor’s office transferred monies from the Maintenance Fund to the General Drain Improvement Fund to pay back the GDIF on several drains. Surveyor Sterrett had a copy of what was transferred if the commissioners wanted to view it. The Commissioners stated that they did not need to see the copy of monies transferred.


Chairman Schmierer asked if there was anything further.


Chairman Schmierer adjourned the meeting.