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January 21, 2008 Tape #002


The White County Drainage Board convened at 10:50 A.M. in the Commissioners’ Room of the White County Building, Monticello, Indiana, with Board Members Ron Schmierer, John Heimlich and Steve Burton, Attorney George W. Loy, Surveyor Dennis Sterrett, Drainage Assistant Mary Sterrett and Secretary Jamie Rozzi in attendance.

Others in attendance were Charlie Mellon and Dave Jordan.


The first item of business was reorganization of the Drainage Board for 2008. Board Member Burton made a motion to name Ron Schmierer as President. Board Member Heimlich seconded the motion. Motion carried.


Board Member Heimlich made a motion to keep the same officers as 2007. Those officers are Steve Burton as Vice-President, George W. Loy as Board Attorney, and Jamie Rozzi as Board Secretary. Board Member Burton seconded the motion. Motion carried.


The next item to be discussed was to approve the Drainage Board minutes from January 7th, 2008. Board Member Heimlich moved to approve the minutes as presented. Board Member Burton seconded the motion. Motion carried.


The next item on the agenda was to open maintenance quotes on the Oliver Bell Drain. Attorney Loy stated that more than three or more quotes were solicited and one quote was received from County Line Tiling/Excavating.


Attorney Loy stated, “The quote from County Line Tiling/Excavating was for $2,490.00.”


Board Member Heimlich asked, “What was the Surveyor’s estimate?”


“My estimate was $2,503.94,” Surveyor Sterrett replied.


Board Member Burton made a motion to accept the quote of $2,490.00 from County Line Tiling/Excavating for maintenance on the Oliver Bell Drain. Board Member Heimlich seconded the motion. Motion carried.


The next item on the agenda was to approve and sign ditch assessments. Drainage Assistant Mary Sterrett provided the Drainage Board with a list of the drains that will be collected on in 2008.


Board Member Burton asked, “Are there any changes?”


“We put the A. K. Ruth on which County Line/Tiling Excavating is working on now. The maintenance fund was used for brush and so that fund will be down to zero,” Surveyor Sterrett replied.


“Wasn’t the Esther Fraser off last year? I see that it is back on this year,” stated Board Member Heimlich.


“The W. W. Helfrick has also been put back on,” Surveyor Sterrett explained.


Board Member Burton made a motion to accept and sign the drain assessments. Board Member Heimlich seconded the motion. Motion carried.


The next item on the agenda was to discuss John Duvall’s private crossing at 650 North, East of State Road 39. Surveyor Sterrett explained that it is a private crossing on the I. M. Carnahan Ditch and showed the Board several photos.


Surveyor Sterrett explained, “Mr. Duvall has a bridge that he currently uses and underneath that bridge is two old bridge embankments and it looks like there may have been a railroad rail and concrete across them. The rock retaining wall from the old structure fell in and the rocks in the ditch are that retaining wall.”


“Is he still able to use the bridge?” Board Member Heimlich asked.


“The bridge he currently uses is sitting on the concrete end bents and he must have left the old bridge in and now the water has collapsed the retaining wall. The headwall is in the ditch now,” Surveyor Sterrett explained.


“It is his responsibility to take it out, correct?” Chairman Schmierer asked.


Surveyor Sterrett replied, “Well, it’s a private crossing.”


“What is he asking for?” Attorney Loy asked.


“He wants us to clean out the ditch. It is backing up the ditch. He wants all of the old bridge cleaned out,” Surveyor Sterrett stated.


“Let me go pull the statute on that,” Attorney Loy stated.


“When all of that fell in I think the water went toward the retaining wall and cut the retaining wall out,” Surveyor Sterrett explained.


Attorney Loy read aloud the state statute, “All maintenance of a private crossing is the responsibility of the owner. They are directly responsible for any obstruction or damage to the drain that results from the existence of a private crossing.”


“I would say that Surveyor Sterrett needs a copy of the statute to give to Mr. Duvall, don’t you?” Chairman Schmierer asked.


“Unfortunately, that is what the statute states,” Board Member Burton stated.


Surveyor Sterrett replied, “So, it is his responsibility to get that out of the bottom of the ditch. What if he doesn’t do it?”


Chairman Schmierer replied, “I suppose we could assess his property if he doesn’t do it. He would be better off to do it himself.”


Surveyor Sterrett stated that Dave Jordan was in attendance to discuss Lakeshore Hills Subdivision that has never been developed (located at 425 North, East of 300 East). I don’t know whether he’s trying to purchase the ground or trying to figure out what he needs from the drainage board before he does.”


“What questions do you have for the Drainage Board?” Chairman Schmierer asked.


Mr. Jordan replied, “I guess the first thing is that this has already been accepted as a subdivision. I think one of the things I want to know is drainage. I have photos of it and after all that rain we had it looked pretty dry. There is probably already some retention already built in. I can show you on that map. There is already a road going through there with drainage underneath. I don’t know what they did for drainage other than Jim Milligan had it in there and he had it down to where anyone’s build couldn’t interfere with the drainage. It looks to me like the roads that are there, they actually have ditches and it is taking it off.”


Surveyor Sterrett showed a copy of the letter that Jim Milligan submitted to Area Plan. Surveyor Sterrett also showed a subdivision plat that he got from Area Plan. He explained, “This shows that there are catch basins, but I don’t know if they are in or not. I haven’t been out there.”


Surveyor Sterrett stated, “I don’t know what the sub-drainage is. He does show sub-drainage. There appear to be surface drains drawn in and I don’t know if they are in or not.”


Mr. Jordan stated, “I couldn’t tell you either. It was so weedy when I went in there. There are roads but they have to be upgraded.”


“What is the question that you are asking?” Board Member Burton asked.


“I have a lot of questions. First of all, are we going to have to upgrade the drainage or is it going to be acceptable as it was approved then?” Mr. Jordan asked.


“If it was approved in 1980 and the drainage was approved by Area Plan. Where do we stand with that?” Board Member Burton asked Attorney Loy.


Attorney Loy replied, “I think it is still subject to the drainage ordinance. When you ask if the existing drainage plan is ok…is there an actual drainage plan?”


“No, just what I have shown you is what Area Plan received back in 1980,” Surveyor Sterrett explained.


“It would still be subject to the drainage code…the development of it,” Attorney Loy stated.


“I don’t know if we have answered your question. Attorney Loy has said that it is subject to the drainage ordinance,” Chairman Schmierer stated.


“This is entirely undeveloped other than there are chipped and sealed roads and a pole barn and one home,” Attorney Loy stated.


“It sounds like there is drainage in. Milligan said he put that in,” Mr. Jordan stated.


“What is that drainage plan?” Attorney Loy asked.


Mr. Jordan replied, “I don’t know, I’d have to look at that. I don’t want to develop something that is going to be a problem.”


“I guess if there is a drainage plan floating around out there somewhere, someone needs to find it as it may be perfectly adequate,” Attorney Loy stated.


Surveyor Sterrett replied, “The one I saw in Area Plan was not perfectly adequate.”


“Was it back then?” Mr. Jordan asked.


“We did not have the drainage ordinance then,” Surveyor Sterrett explained.


“It wouldn’t be grandfathered in?” Mr. Jordan asked.


Attorney Loy replied, “No, because the drainage ordinance applies whenever there is going to be development of this size or nature.”


Chairman Schmierer explained, “I know we didn’t answer all of your questions, but we have tried to answer the drainage questions. I hate to tell you but I think you’ll have to come back to the board. What do you think Board Member Heimlich?”


“I think we have to digest some of this too,” Board Member Heimlich added.


Board Member Burton also added, “Right, I think Attorney Loy answered my question…whether or not he’s grandfathered in on the 1980. If he’s not, then yes, we’ll have to go by current rules.”


“I don’t know because I don’t know the law, but if that were the case and this was not accepted everyone who wants to get a building permit has to apply to that current law,” Mr. Jordan stated.


“And that’s the case,” both Board Member Burton and Board Member Heimlich replied.


“If someone has a subdivision upstream that is entirely undeveloped you don’t want him to flood you out,” Attorney Loy explained.


“I don’t think a drainage plan would be that big of deal,” Attorney Loy stated.


Mr. Jordan asked, “So I understand what you are thinking is that he put field tile through there?”


Board Member Burton replied, “We would be assuming. It might be on the drawing but that doesn’t mean that it’s there.”


“With that many houses in there the issue would be surface water,” Board Member Heimlich stated.


“And the street water,” Surveyor Sterrett added.


“It should be easy to get drainage plans but you do need a plan of some kind," Board Member Heimlich explained.


“It might be already in, so I would check with Mr. Milligan and see what he has. It shows tile and everything. It could be going right to the Hoagland,” Chairman Schmierer commented.


“Can I get a copy of what Area Plan has?” Mr. Jordan asked. Surveyor Sterrett gave Mr. Jordan a copy of Lakeshore Hills Subdivision that he had obtained from Area Plan.


Surveyor Sterrett reported that both the town of Monon and the town of Wolcott has called him since receiving all the rain (January 8th, 2008). In the town of Monon, there has been a mobile home that has been sitting on a tile hole for some time. The landowner has decided to move the mobile home. Water had got up into the mobile home and they have decided to move it, so we will be able to get that tile hole fixed. The town of Wolcott called because they couldn’t find the location of a tile over there and they wanted to know if I had any location on it. It was a private tile and the Surveyor had no information to give them.


Board Member Heimlich reported that he had been in Wolcott on Wednesday afternoon and expected to see the park underwater. He said that the water was all gone. The roots that were taken out to the north of that must have solved the problems with that tile.


Chairman Schmierer asked if there was anything further for the drainage board. Chairman Schmierer then adjourned the meeting.