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The White County Area Plan Commission met Monday, November 14, 2005, at 7:30 p.m. in the Commissioners’ Meeting Room, Second Floor, County Building, Monticello, Indiana.

Members attending were: Jay Clawson, Gary Barbour, David Rosenbarger, Charles Anderson, David Scott, Charles Mellon, Donald W. Ward, Gregory Bossaer, Dennis Sterrett. Also attending were Attorney Altman and Director Weaver.

Visitors Attending were: Melanie Green, Ken Green, Richard Law, Maureen Law, Don Pauken, Bill Pyle, Tom Parsley, Ruth Bortscheller, Angie Hartzler, Troy Hartzler, Elaine J. Kaiser, Ron Kaiser, Mike Bortscheller, Rhonda Burke, Ingrid Landis, Tom Burke, Mary Jo Burke, Charles Burke, Terri Raines, John Raines, Terry Beasy, Brad Smock, William

The meeting was called to order by President Charles Anderson and roll call was taken. Don Ward made a motion to dispense with reading and approve the minutes of the October 11, 2005 meeting. Motion was seconded by Charles Mellon and carried unanimously.

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#890 Kenneth R. & Melanie L. Green; The property is 5.000 acres, more or less North of Monticello at 5207 E. Bay Front Court. Tabled from the October 11, 2005 meeting.

Violation: The buildings are already being used for boat storage.

Request: They are requesting to rezone from A-1 to B-2.

President Charles Anderson asked, is there anyone here representing this request? Come forwards.

 

Melanie Green stated, Melanie Green.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, we had asked for a commitment on changing the road on that.

Do you have anything?

 

Melanie Green stated, right, I have a commitment letter here and also at the last meeting we were asking for the whole 5-acre tract back there to be rezoned. We have reconsidered that in the time sense and have had Jim Milligan draft a new legal description that only includes half of that property and I have included that on the commitment letter. When I talked to Diann and since I

was asking for less I wouldn’t have to put in a new application, but just in case I have a commitment letter for the whole area. A commitment letter for the smaller portion.

 

President Charles Anderson asked, what does our lawyer say about that?

 

Attorney Altman stated, she can down size it, yes without re-advertising it.

 

President Charles Anderson asked, do any of the commissioners have any questions about that?

 

Melanie Green stated, in this commitment letter we were asked to commit to only using the B-2 rezoning for the purpose that we were asking it for, which was boat storage so we have put that in the commitment letter. We were also asked to put in a road leading from Lake Road 28 East back through our property, so our boat customers wouldn’t have to bring the boats on Bay Front Court up through the park to the boat storage. We have indicated that in the commitment letter that we would be committed to doing that. We were also asked to commission a drainage plan by a survey company to be presented to the Drainage Board. We have started that process, but that takes longer than a month so we have committed that process as well as to complying that the Drainage Board see necessary from the drainage plan.

 

President Charles Anderson asked, do any of the commissioners have any questions?

 

Attorney Altman stated, I’ve never seen the commitments.

 

Melanie Green stated, I have them right here.

 

President Charles Anderson asked, so you’ve never presented them to the Area Plan office?

 

Melanie Green stated, no I never brought them ahead of time.

 

President Charles Anderson asked, do the commissioners have any questions?

 

Melanie Green stated, I have several copies.

 

Director Weaver stated, the original needs to go to our Attorney.

 

President Charles Anderson asked, anybody in the audience have any questions about this request at all?

 

Ruth Bortscheller stated, I’m Ruth Bortscheller and I would like to have an explanation from any of you people of why when we came on October 11 and we were told to return today, why was a permit issued and why is construction beginning? I thought we had to go through today or is this how it is normally that you go and your told to go another day, but you issued a permit so you can start building.

 

Director Weaver stated, there was a permit and I have explained this to Bortscheller that there was a permit issued for a personal storage structure. They already had their plans approved, they already had the drainage approved for this structure and they’ve changed the use of the structure to where it would have been in compliance so a permit was issued. There was a commitment and I have sent the board a copy of this permit. There was a commitment on the building permit that it could not be used for business use without the property being rezoned and being in compliance first.

 

Ruth Bortscheller stated, okay explain something to me, if we were concerned with the drainage problem is it any difference of what you are going to put in this building. I mean still once the building is up there is going to be a drainage problem no matter what you put in there. I’m not going to lie to any of you people I am totally, totally frustrated and confused over this whole thing. All I pushed for was don’t bring them down East Bay Front Court. Now I’m upset and I’m going to say a statement that will hurt you people, but when I saw that building going up I thought I lived back at 3437 S. Oakley in Chicago. That is what I really, really thought. I just don’t understand why we were told to come back today if, and sorry Diann, it just is not sinking in of why was a permit issued when there was so much of a drainage problem in question. Why weren’t we told maybe like don’t bother coming everything is passed. Or is everything passed. There is nothing passed.

 

Director Weaver stated, the structure is not large enough to require a drainage plan. They already had approval for the structure before they came to this meeting last month from the Surveyor’s Office.

 

Ruth Bortscheller stated, but they can not build any other ones.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, no for the business itself. We are trying to decide now for the business part of it.

 

Ruth Bortscheller stated, well I guess I don’t understand it, if we have a drainage problem we are going to have a drainage problem no matter what it is. The other thing we would like to have is a sign on East 28 if everything gets passed that, that is where they go in and not come down to East Bay Front Court.

 

President Charles Anderson asked, did you address that on the commitment?

 

Melanie Green stated, I didn’t put it in the commitment letter, but I have that in for my notes we would put the road in and indicate with a sign, but I didn’t put the sign, just the road in the commitment letter.

 

President Charles Anderson asked, so what does the lawyer say about that?

 

Attorney Altman stated, I understand the permit issued was for a very specific use and that was the personal use only. I’m just reading that is was a storage shed, excuse me a pole barn farm and that would not allow for any of the storage that she is asking for under the present zoning, rezoning request. She would not be able to use it that way at all unless it is rezoned. She would be able to use it as a farm building.

 

President Charles Anderson asked, do any of the Commissioners have any questions on what went down on that?

 

Don Ward stated, well if we rezone it to business then the buildings must comply.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, with the new business, new drainage plan. So they would have to comply with the business us if we pass this tonight.

 

Don Ward stated, yes.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, she has just like you wanted to build a building on your property and you’ve gone through all the ways to do that and they say get a permit. You can build your building on your own personal property for your own personal use and that is what has went down, exactly why it went down that way I have no idea.

 

Tom Burke stated, I’m Tom Burke, I live on the backside of where they are trying to build. I’ve got a couple issues. What would those buildings have to conform too? I live on a private road on the backside of where they are building. When you say put a private road in, who is going to maintain it and who is going to pay for it and what kind of traffic is going to be on it, what else can it be used for? Also it is real interesting there is a drainage issue here. I’m on the backside of it where the gully goes into Lake Shafer, what is the name of that, it is Keans Bay. The drainage is going to go basically to the right of my property into that gully and no one has contacted me about a drainage plan, drainage assessment, drainage questions. I think that is a pretty good question.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, the drainage permit hasn’t been issued yet. Drainage plan hasn’t been….

 

Tom Burke stated, if you can alter the property to alter the drainage, as the water would go through the property on the private road that I pay for. This isn’t a county road, this is a private road that I write a check for to maintain it isn’t plowed I would think I would have access to that information if that is being altered.

 

Director Weaver stated, that is something that will be address through the drainage board before them.

 

Tom Burke stated, will there have to be an occupancy permit for this building issued?

 

Director Weaver stated, that is not something that Area Plan does that is something that the building department does.

 

Tom Burke stated, okay, your counsel can answer that. In this process is there an occupancy permit that will be issued and then the building will be able to be used prior to the approval of the zoning or is that after the approval of zoning.

 

Attorney Altman stated, that would be after, generally it is after because there. Under the conditions of the permit that was issued which would be for the farm pole building like the permit says, if they are going to use it that way and that way only. As I understand the ordinance in talking to the Director it would be able to do it the way it is being built right now and once it is built they would be able to get the occupancy permit to occupy it the way it is restricted. I’m going through this, I think it needs to be clarified, but if they want to do it and use it the way this request is through this rezoning is they would have to go through and first of all get a vote from this board. Secondly, get a vote from the County Commissioners. Third, get the approval through the drainage board. The Commissioners may as well want that done before they vote on the rezoning. That is theirs to decide. I can’t speak for them on that.

 

Tom Burke asked, that is the process?

 

Attorney Altman stated, that is the process. Then they would have to get it, would seem to me a new permit. Other wise they are still stuck with this permit and then they would also have to get it inspected and an occupancy permit allowing them to use it like everyone here is hearing.

 

Tom Burke stated, so what you are saying the current way it is zoned it is for agriculture, meaning agriculture farm implements equipment, farm animals, stuff like that.

 

Attorney Altman stated, is says pole barn.

 

Director Weaver stated, it is a pole building..

 

Tom Burke stated, I have lived there for 14 years.

 

Attorney Altman stated, personal storage, I’m sorry, I’m looking at something that says pole building farm.

 

Director Weaver stated, that is for the previous buildings.

 

Attorney Altman stated, excuse me, then let me make sure. The permit is this one.

 

Tom Burke stated, it is currently zoned agriculture is the way I understand it, it is zoned that way.

 

Attorney Altman stated, let me look at it here, the proposed use is storage shed. Personal storage shed. That is all they can do.

 

Tom Burke stated, but it is currently zoned for farming, agriculture.

 

Attorney Altman stated, A-1, yes.

 

Tom Burke stated, okay I’ve lived back there for 14 years and have never seen any farm implements going in and out of those buildings and that. My question is, if it is zoned for one thing and it is being used for another what is there a path other than the application process that they are going through.

 

Don Ward stated, that is what we are trying to do.

 

Attorney Altman stated, that is the path that we are trying to do right now, as I understand it.

 

Tom Burke stated, clearly if it is zoned agriculture and it is being used for a commercial entity. Right now it is a violation.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, yes, we’ve already got that.

 

Tom Burke stated, if all of the buildings are zoned agriculture and they are currently being used in a commercial manner for profit that is totally not what the zoning was intended for correct.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, they’ve got a violation on it already and they’ve been sent a violation and we will deal with that tonight.

 

Attorney Altman stated, that is part of the evidence that we are going to have.

 

Tom Burke stated, okay then the drainage board will notify us by register mail if there is a change.

 

Director Weaver stated, I can’t tell you what their process is.

 

Tom Burke stated, okay. Our road is private, when it comes time to write that check for the asphalt, you’ve got a better chance of winning the lottery then getting a check out some people. It is quite uncomfortable. There has got to be a reasonable expectation to maintain it, there has got to be some description, definition as to is it going to be circle is it going to be around where is it going to go. I think from the private road aspect you’ve got to have some guidelines if you are going to put it in, who is going to maintain it, who is going to pay for it, what are the guidelines to maintaining it.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, actually it is for the access to their business and it would be up to them to maintain it, it is on their property.

 

Tom Burke stated, okay so this could be a dirt road then.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, no it can’t.

 

Tom Burke stated, okay then define what a road is.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, you’ve got a minute.

 

Tom Burke stated, that is why I’m here.

 

Don Ward stated, it could be a dirt road. It is a business, it is one that they are going to have to use to bring the boats in and out. If they want a dirt road that is their business, but.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, but it would be beneficial being stuck all the time.

 

Tom Burke stated, what about the fact that you are going to have a commercial entity surrounded by all residential, is that concerning anybody. When you say commercial can it be more than storage, could it be service, maintenance, what else can be done.

 

Don Ward stated, they have stated it is going to be boat storage period that is the agreement.

 

Jay Clawson stated, that is why we asked for the commitment to narrow it down so it is not a broad thing that they can run anything that fits in our B-2 business uses to be moved in there that would definitely cause a lot of trouble in that type of neighborhood.

 

Tom Burke stated, so it’s like the current zoning verses what the request is. I mean there is not going to be anybody looking at this to make sure that there is not going to be any other business being run out of there other than storage.

 

Don Ward stated, what happens is that some one there reports it.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, they are not suppose to, it wouldn’t be in compliance with what they are asking for if they did run another business out of there.

 

Tom Burke stated, okay thank you very much.

 

President Charles Anderson asked, are there any other questions from the audience on this?

 

Attorney Altman stated, let me talk for a little bit before we go ahead. I’ve been handed a copy of the written commitment just laid eyeballs on it. It is from the Greens to our department, it is somewhat similar form that we have seen and used before. It is for located at 5.00 adjoining 5204 East Bay Front Court in Liberty Township. It describes the lot or I mean the legal description containing 2.304 of an acre more or less. (See file for commitment.) Jerry is reading the commitment at this time. I just got this and I’m reading it out loud to everyone here.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, we did ask last time was for the drive to be done within one year and we did ask for crush stone. That was a motion by Jay Clawson and second by Don Ward, so we did ask for that and it is not written down. It did state crush stone.

 

Attorney Altman stated, that would be required.

 

Ruth Bortscheller stated, my other question is, I think Melanie said that she was down sizing something.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, she is just making the lot, instead of using 5 acres she is going to use 2 acres.

 

Ruth Bortscheller stated, okay what 2.5, like are we still going to come in on East 2.8 or are we just going to use that back park and coming in through East Bay Front Court in through the trailer court.

 

President Charles Anderson asked, do you want to respond to that and state your name again?

 

Melanie Green stated, that part that I’m rezoning is familiar with that back 5 acres. There is a ravine back there and we are rezoning from the part from 28 East to the ravine is not being rezoned because we have no intent to put buildings there. We are rezoning from the ravine to 100 feet past where the current buildings are. So a small section of the East End is not being rezoned because there is a slope there and it really isn’t usable for that. Then the part closes to the road will remain field just like it is now. The access road, we did plan for it to be gravel and there are some new people here from our neighborhood than last time. I just want to make it clear that these boat storage buildings have been there for 6 years and we just bought this property one year ago this September. Upon applying for the building permit to put up another building is when we found out it wasn’t zoned properly in the first place. It is being used for this use through the time we purchased the property and we were unaware.

 

Ruth Bortscheller stated, these, I feel sorry for these kids because they got and I’ve got 5 years of receipts to show that I have put my boat in one of those three barns. My question is that is grandfathered in and is some going to go to the previous owner and say something. If not this is going in as personal now what if they start putting boat storage in and then they don’t ever come back are we having a repeat of the 3 barns that are there for farm equipment.

 

Melanie Green stated, we are rezoning the two buildings that face each other on the property the oldest building is there for use of the people who live in the park and that is not included in the rezoning. The two newer buildings and any proposed one and the one we are trying to build right now is the only thing being rezoned with that section of property.

 

Ingrid Landis stated, I just don’t understand this because at the last meeting I think all of my neighbors and I understood that there would not be a permit issued until they went to the drainage board and checked this out. Low and behold three or four days later we see a building going up. All of us are very upset over this, so the building is still going up whether there is a problem with drainage or not. The building is still going up and none of us know that answer. I don’t think it is right.

 

Melanie Green stated, I would like to address from the last meeting that concern of drainage only came up when we talked about adding the road in from 28 East because that is what put us over the amount of ground that can be covered to have to be considered for drainage. The building itself is not big enough to have to concern that. I have checked that when I applied for the building permit initially. That is why it wasn’t needing to be address until our October meeting when it was brought up with the road.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, this building you are planning on using it for storage if we do pass this as far as that is why the building is going up.

 

Melanie Green stated, exactly.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, so really it wasn’t in good taste to start with a building that we really haven’t given you permit to use the use that you actually want to use it for.

 

Melanie Green stated, but we….

 

President Charles Anderson stated, I don’t think it was in very good taste at all myself personally.

 

Melanie Green stated, we fully understand that we can’t use it until it is rezoned. That is just a business risk that we are taking on our own in able to have a building there.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, at that the same token you still threw the neighbors off and I didn’t think you were going to have a whole lot of trouble with your neighbors until you started doing this.

 

Melanie Green stated, we had the permit before we even came to the October meeting.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, it doesn’t matter.

 

Melanie Green stated, it was afterwards okay I don’t remember the dates.

 

Director Weaver stated, no you didn’t have it until after. You had applied for it, but it had not been issued.

 

President Charles Anderson asked, do any of the commissioners have anything?

 

Charles Mellon stated, are you splitting that 5 acres, the 2.5 is out where you don’t need the drainage is that what you are trying to say. You don’t need the drainage on the 2.5 acres that you want rezoned and on the other side on the road where you are not going to put any buildings is that the one that needed the drainage on it.

 

Melanie Green stated, no, in talking to Jim Milligan I asked him if there, he is the one doing our drainage plan, I asked him if there is any difference in rezoning the full part of just a section would that change any of the drainage plan. He said no it had no bearing on it. Basically we aren’t going to be using that outer section so really boils down to the property tax. Once I thought about it, why should I rezone the whole 5 acres when I’m not going to put business on the whole 5 acres.

 

Charles Mellon asked, where you are going to put the road is there any drainage around that road?

 

Melanie Green stated, that will be address in the drainage plan. He will take a look at the whole road section.

 

Charles Mellon stated, well you should have had that drainage plan done before this is approved.

 

Melanie Green stated, well that is why put it in the commitment letter because they couldn’t get that done in time. That we would comply with having a drainage plan and anything it asked it to do when we presented it to the drainage board.

 

Charles Mellon stated, he said you didn’t need it so you didn’t put it in the form.

 

Melanie Green stated, it is in the commitment to do the drainage plan and comply.

 

Don Ward asked, where is the 2.5 acres that you intend to change? If you are going to put a road through you can’t, you just can’t take it out of the middle. We don’t want it out of the middle.

 

Melanie Green stated, the access road is on the property that we own, so.

 

Don Ward stated, it still has to be in this rezoning.

 

Melanie Green stated, well then I have a commitment letter that includes the whole thing if it was going to be a problem I can include the whole thing.

 

Jay Clawson stated, with space available to frontage road you are not going to have the useable lot when you divided that out with what you are going to have to go because that legal description what is the minimum frontage for a B-2 in an area.

 

Director Weaver stated, I will have to look that up.

 

Melanie Green stated, if that is a problem…

 

Jay Clawson stated, it might be better to leave the whole 5 acres in there.

 

Don Ward stated, if you want to leave part of it out make sure it is East of the buildings.

 

Ingrid Landis stated, it seems that we keep bouncing from well I’ll do this or maybe I’ll do this or maybe I’ll do this, whatever is going to work for me you know I’ve got another plan, but this is not what we were told at the last meeting. There is a building in question, well really there isn’t one building in question there are how many buildings in question because the other 4 or how ever many there are, those weren’t zoned right to begin with and so there was never a drainage plan done on any of those either. We are not looking at the drainage on just one building it is all of the buildings there together, plus the road they are going to put in.

 

David Rosenbarger stated, well the drainage plan would have to go with everything on that lot.

 

Ingrid Landis stated, okay well they are acting like it is just this building that we are concerned about.

 

Don Ward stated, no, they understand that it is all 4 buildings, it is the whole piece of property.

 

Ingrid Landis stated, they have went ahead and put the building up already.

 

Don Ward stated, well that is their risk.

 

David Rosenbarger stated, they are putting up a building that they don’t know if they can use or not.

 

Don Ward stated, they can use it for agriculture.

 

Ingrid Landis asked, if it is denied then what?

 

Don Ward stated, then they are stuck with it as a horse barn.

 

Tom Burke stated, I’ve got a couple of questions, someone taking notes here or what.

 

Several answered it is being recorded.

 

Tom Burke stated, as to the zoning prior to them having ownership is really their issue with the prior owner that doesn’t involve us. My question you know on this size of a lot since you are looking at altering the drainage and putting in streets and things guys you’ve got to be realistic here can this turn into a public storage property like to you see on the sides of 65. How many pole barns can you put up density per acre in this type of a structure or foot print. The other thing is the buildings are they 5’ apart, 10’ apart how big can be, can they be monster buildings like you see up north on I-65 I mean what are we dealing with here. What is the future, whatever foot print that you approve now I’m sure there is going to be expansion. Nothing against them, but I’m sure there will be expansion. I’ve got just like all of these people here have money at risk and property values maintain their values and all we are trying to do is maintain our values. So really what is the long term plan here and how do you figure out the footprint because I’m sure god bless them it is America and they can do this what is the limits on the number of buildings that they can put on that space.

 

President Charles Anderson asked, do you want to address that?

 

Tom Burke stated, I think that is a good question.

 

Director Weaver stated, as long as they can meet the setback requirements.

 

Tom Burke stated, I think those are legit questions.

 

Attorney Altman stated, we are trying to get you your answers.

 

Tom Burke stated, I just think those are pretty basic questions.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, if we do the whole 5 acres there can be more buildings on the whole 5 acres.

 

Several are talking at once.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, the main thing we are trying to do is solve a problem that we had that was created by another person and how it got by, if we can solve it we will if we can’t solve it we can’t.

 

Ruth Bortscheller stated, I think I spoke for my road and I think you did agree is all we were concerned about was how traffic was going to flow and things. It just seems now that everything is going every direction and I don’t think as homeowners that we are being treated properly.

 

President Charles Anderson asked, do any of the Commissioners want to respond to that? Do any of the Commissioners want to respond to starting the building before we had the…

 

Don Ward stated, well that is their risk. Nothing we can do about that.

 

Tom Burke stated, what is the consequence of that.

 

Attorney Altman stated, no you have to come up front.

 

Tom Burke stated, sorry I didn’t know we were doing Robert’s rule here, I apologize. What are the consequence I mean what happens here and they put a building up and it can’ be occupied.

 

Don Ward stated, it can be occupied, it just can’t be occupied for what they want.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, it can be used for business. They can’t run it as boat storage.

 

Don Ward stated, they can put a chicken farm in there.

 

Tom Burke stated, that is wonderful I can smell those chickens, or the hogs or whatever.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, it is zoned agriculture.

 

Tom Burke stated, what I’m getting here is if you have a zoning problem and there are penalties and consequence and what I want to know is what happens what is the path of this being denied.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, right now they’ve got, they are out of compliance and there is a fine for that whether we give them a fine or not they are still out of compliance and we still have to deal with that to at this meeting. They were sent a letter about that. The main thing we tried to get through the last meeting is what would make it easier for the property owners around that, what concerns that they would have and what could we do to better that property and still allow them to have that boat storage. Until they started building that building we thought we had it solved, but evidently we do not have it solved.

 

Ruth Bortscheller stated, I know I have a question we know they are in violation for 3 of those buildings and we knew that in October. What is happening if they are still going to use it or can they not use it until that violation gets eliminated.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, it is up to this board to determine whether they can continue or whether we are going to fine them or whether….

 

Ruth Bortscheller stated, I can understand if they bought and they didn’t have a clue that we were putting boats in there. Now they do and if boats are still going in before this is rectified what is penalty that way.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, there is a fine and we can and there is a minimum amount we can fine them or we can fine them per day for having things in there that are not suppose to be in there, but right now we are trying to solve the problem and see if we can get it zoned the way it is suppose to be. That is what this meeting is all about. Do the Commissioners want to help out on this at all?

 

Don Ward stated, basically that is it. We are trying to get it back into compliance and get everyone satisfied.

 

Richard Law stated, I’m Richard Law, excuse me I got ran over by a flu truck this morning. I probably have a unique situation here. I think I’m the only one present here tonight that owns property adjacent to Bayfront Mobile Home Court. The other aspect that makes it unique is I have been a resident of Bayfront Mobile Home Court for 21 years. I’ve been through three owners at this location and I must say in the past it was one owner that created tremendous conflict in our neighborhood and I don’t want to bore you with that. I was unaware of last months meeting until I heard later about some of the concerns and complaints of the neighbors and so forth. Most of them I know. I really don’t understand it. These are probably the best landlords I have ever had at Bayfront Mobile Home Court, they are industrious, and they check everything out deeply. It was two months ago maybe 6 to 8 weeks ago I happen to be out there with Wrede and Son’s measuring for this road that we are talking about. These things are coming in, these things are being meet to the demands of the neighbors, it is no where near any of their properties once the drainage aspect is met. So I don’t know what the problem is and I wasn’t here last month and I’m sorry maybe you have a question for me or anybody else in the audience I will be happy to give my opinion.

 

President Charles Anderson asked, do any of the Commissioners have any questions for him?

 

Don Ward asked, where is your property at?

 

Richard Law stated, it is Lazy Acres Court which is adjacent to Bayfront Mobile Home Park.

 

Attorney Altman asked, which lot is yours?

 

Richard Law asked, do you want me to show you on the map? (He went up and showed them on the map where his lot is.) I plan on being carted out and the only reason is the type of people that these people are and two owners ago and the friends and the commeroded of that community. I don’t know what all of this bickering is about. Thank you very much.

 

Tom Burke stated, I’m sorry I feel like I’m wearing a path here. I don’t think there is any bickering I think when people have questions it usually a real question in this issue and it is not anything personal. I think it is a communication issue. I think really and I think there are some pretty basic questions that have to be answered and resolved. I don’t think there is any intent to hurt anybody here or anything like that. Like my neighbors I would like some questions answered in a reasonable manner and I think this is what this is suppose to do in a format that we can ask questions and get correct answers. That is really all we are here for, we are not here to hurt anybody or we have a right to this process and I think it is communication about how it was going on and I just think some answers are do, that is all.

 

Don Ward asked, would it satisfy most of you if we held off until we saw that drainage plan?

 

Ingrid Landis stated, it would me.

 

Ruth Bortscheller asked, are we going to see it or get things like it is okay its passed okay Diann give her the permit now?

 

Don Ward stated, you can see it.

 

Ruth Bortscheller asked, will we be notified about it?

 

Don Ward stated, well we would have a meeting, they would not, we want to vote on this tonight, but…

 

Tom Burke asked, how would you notify the people that the drainage would affect, that is the concern how do you notify them?

 

Don Ward stated, I don’t know.

 

Director Weaver stated, that is what I’m saying we don’t, we have no part in that drainage plan, that is through the surveyor’s office.

 

Dennis Sterrett stated, there is a notice post in here at the courthouse, the drainage plan will be reviewed. There will be a noticed post here on the wall in the courthouse the day of the review. A week before.

 

Tom Burke stated, that gets back to the communication, you have a challenge to communicate in the surrounding properties what the intent is here. I think you have a big challenge, you’ve got to tell the people that are in the community in Bay Front Court when the meeting is, what the topic is. I think that is reasonable to do.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, I don’t think that is a part of Area Plan to do that, I think it is the person who wants to change their property may want to do something. Any questions or suggestions form the Commissioners.

 

Greg Bossaer stated, I agree with Don and I would also like to see where this road is going.

 

Melanie Green stated, maybe the photocopy didn’t come out very clear, but it is marked on the photocopy.

 

(Currently going over the photo copies.)

 

Melanie Green stated, it will be in compliance with the farm field that is there and our property. Running along the top edge of that 5 acres back to the center to where the buildings are and curving down.

 

President Charles Anderson asked, do you in the area have a local association that you belong to?

 

Ruth Bortscheller stated, yes, I’m secretary/treasure to the Lake Shafer Welfare Association. I would say everyone is in this.

 

President Charles Anderson asked is this in the same group at all?

 

Ruth Bortscheller stated, no, we were formed in 1934 for the Welfare of the lake to make it safer. Things like that.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, 6 years ago when they started this boat storage facility and you started storing our boat there.

 

Ruth Bortscheller stated, because I live right down the road from it.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, but what was your determination as far why was it okay then, but now its not going to be okay.

 

Ruth Bortscheller stated, the additional traffic, if you go back to your minutes last month I said the only thing I was opposed to is more traffic, if those three buildings still come down East Bay Front I can live with that because we have lived with it for years. I’m here to object to more traffic coming and putting more boat storage and more boat traffic down the roads.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, if the traffic did come off the other county road to it and the drainage passed on it, would you be oppose to what she is going right now.

 

Ruth Bortscheller stated, no, I think the thing we are all upset with is the fact in October we were told to come back today and within we saw a building going up. I called Diann and I talked to Jerry’s secretary and that is the part we got upset about. I think if that permit was not issued and that building would not be going up, I think you would see a different tone of people in this audience. I mean we think now if that was passed how much more will pass with us knowing it.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, as far as running a business she can’t do anything else, actually she can’t run the business until she gets it rezoned the way it is suppose to be.

 

Ruth Bortscheller stated, so how are you handling the 3 other buildings are you handling it as two different issues.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, there is the fine and whether we give her a fine and whether this pass or we can get everybody in that area to agree to allow something like that. Then the Commissioners will pass that as a business we will handle that at that point. Right now it has been an on going business for some years and we don’t want to shut someone down if we can solve the problem and get her boat storage in for her the way you guys around there would like to have it and with the drainage.

 

Ruth Bortscheller stated, remember we are not upset about the 3 existing buildings, what we are here is questioning the new area that is going up and the new road going up. That is what we are wanting to have a say on.

 

Charles Mellon stated, if they put that new road in and don’t’ bother coming up around you folks and the other road that they have been going in, those buildings that they are putting up are going to be farther away from that road. They will be closer to the road they are putting in. Will that satisfy you then.

 

Ruth Bortscheller stated, yes. That is what I said last month, today I thought we were going to come and see the plan for the drainage.

 

Charles Mellon stated, she has that on what she brought even though the guy who fixed up her thing said he didn’t need it and I don’t know why that is. The Drainage Board that he conducts meet at 10:30 every other Monday and it looks to me she is going to have to come and get her drainage permit first.

 

Ruth Bortscheller stated, I don’t think we are trying to be bitchy neighbors I really don’t. I think we are really trying to work with them. It didn’t seem we are working with them now that the building is going up and we are still setting here wondering what is going to happen next. As I told you once before this is a typical, typical thing that happens in Chicago. If you let the first stage go the second stage will go and the third stage will go and then by then you don’t have a foot to stand on. What my father and mother worked hard for is going to go down the drain because I’m going to make someone happy over an extra road or something else, I don’t think so. I really don’t.

 

Melanie Green stated, basically I need to apologize to my neighbors, we are new business owners and new to doing business and really just need to apologize and misstep and not communicating with the neighbors. We were very busy this summer and didn’t meet most of you, we meet some of you. Just being new in business we are sorry we missed that step in the communication.

 

President Charles Anderson asked, would you be willing to go to their association and talk about what you want to do and get your drainage plan developed before we go ahead with this?

 

Melanie Green stated, as far as being a member of the Lake Association and I did become a member of that this summer, but as far as our community goes, I’m going to have to find out the address of people and contact them and have a meeting. That is just a miss step and I don’t mind doing that.

 

Ruth Bortscheller stated, I don’t think the Lake Association, I think she needs to be concerned about East Bay Front Court residence. WE have 700 members all the way from the dam to buffalo, I don’t think you want all of those people involved. I think the people she needs to please and calm us down are on East Bay Front Court.

 

President Charles Anderson asked, can you right up a list and give that to her?

 

Ruth Bortscheller stated, yes happy to.

 

Tom Burke stated, I think, good for buying a business, good for you. I think that is wonderful. I think there are a couple different questions that you have to answer here. Let me tell you where I think those questions are coming from, most of the buildings that were put up were put up in the fall. So when we would come back in the spring we would notice another building up there. The traffic became heavier and heavier I can tell you time after time and there is a pontoon boat.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, we already know about the traffic and she is going to solve that by bringing in a road in from the other way.

 

Tom Burke stated, I’m trying to explain how this why there.

 

President Charles Anderson asked, did she own those buildings then?

 

Tom Burke stated, no she wasn’t, but there would be people who dropped their boats off waiting to be put up. I think the real ultimate question for me is and for some of my neighbors is we bought residential section, we bought residential area. I didn’t buy commercial area, and nothing against them, I’m a small business man too and I think you’ve got to think pretty hard about people who are putting large amounts of money in these homes and community on this lake and tear them down and fix them up. It is happening in our neighborhood and you are going to have a horseshoe basically of residential homes and dead set in the middle a commercial property that has no defining boundaries. No body has defined how many buildings they can put up.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, that is another thing you can discuss and that can be written in the commitment too.

 

Tom Burke stated, my point is that I think I bought in a residential area, I didn’t by the commercial area.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, the commercial area was already there, but you didn’t realize at that point you had a say so.

 

Tom Burke stated, actually I bought 14 years ago and those buildings were put up in the fall without any notification and I had no idea we came in the spring and they were already up. What is what do we do. It is not my fault who do I complain to.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, all she is trying to do is rectify a problem that was created by somebody else and she is trying to do it to the best that she owns. I don’t think she is….

 

Tom Burke stated, I don’t think she is, I’m just saying that I think you have a bouncing act here.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, that is just it, it will be bound by a commitment on this and still allow her to run her boat storage. There has to be boat storage around the lakes, which is what the lakes are for, is for boating and water sports.

 

Tom Burke stated, yes you are correct. They are most of the storage I’ve seen for this type of situation is our in a rural area.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, we have it right in Monticello too.

 

Tom Burke stated, well you know where I’m from they are in rural areas they're not.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, she is in the rural area, she is in agriculture area.

 

Tom Burke stated, yea and they are supposed to be putting trackers and equipment in there.

 

President Charles Anderson asked, do you want the horses, cows, and etc?

 

Charles Mellon stated, there has been boats stored there a long time before she got it. I know they guy who owned it, I knew there had been boats stored there a long time before.

 

Melanie Green stated, a point I wanted to make and I don’t know if it has any bearing at all, is as we were checking to see after our October meeting so we know of other people who store boats and big business and small business are they zoned properly. I was shocked on the people we check on was not zoned properly.

 

Mike Bortscheller stated, the main thing that a lot of us came to the first meeting was because of the road and the deterioration of the road in spot or two spots especially near the creek especially with these boat trailers going over and over.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, that is the main thing we are trying to solve by putting another road in.

 

Charles Burke stated, I’m Charles Burke, I came an hour ago and I have to say something about the traffic. In support of Mr. ??? I visit people on Bay Front Court frequently during the summer time. Never during the 3 or 4 months of summer do I go down Bay Front Court without experiencing some kind of boat traffic. We have discussed that and you are aware of that. My point in repeating that is this, the council read some conditions that you are prepared to ask. One of the conditions that I would ask is support would be an uninterrupted fence separating this ladies trailer court from the buildings on the back part of her property. The reason I say that if you put in a new road coming in from East 28 all you really going to do is make a horse shoe. They are going to come in the new road down there the agriculture building area, down through the trailer court onto Bay Front Court and we’ve got again traffic congestion. I would ask that if you do choose to use those buildings that you require the landowner to put in a fence that would preclude any traffic other than residential traffic in the trailer court.

 

David Rosenbarger stated, isn’t that in our ordinance any way?

 

Director Weaver stated, yes, residential protection, yes.

 

Charles Burke stated, I also have a question council. Isn’t the, Dennis Sterrett in his ditch control, water control, isn’t that considered a public entity aren’t they required by law to publish minutes of their meeting and aren’t they required by law to publish those minutes so many weeks prior to the meeting.

 

Attorney Altman stated, they have notice requirements, yes. They have to comply with yes.

 

Charles Burke stated, sir he said the notices posted two or three days before the meeting I found that…

 

President Charles Anderson stated, they have to give minutes of the meeting afterwards.

 

Charles Burke stated, that is too late.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, I know that is what I’m saying.

 

Attorney Altman stated, they have a notice requirement and I know they comply with it, I’m not familiar with that because I’m not the attorney for that board, they do have to do that.

 

Dennis Sterrett stated, I have to check to see what that was.

 

Charles Burke stated, I would hope sir that you give a response to this group before there is any further action on the question before this group tonight.

 

Ruth Bortscheller stated, I would have to agree with him and it never crossed our mines, but now that he is saying it, it is true. If they put in that gravel road by the new building, they can just cut through these three existing buildings come right down and we will have all of the traffic again.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, once they rezone the have to put in sometime of structure around it.

 

Ruth Bortscheller stated, the new structure or all three of them.

 

David Rosenbarger stated, anything around the residential.

 

Ruth Bortscheller stated, even though they are on the private property.

 

David Rosenbarger stated, where ever the business and the residential meet there has to be a fence.

 

Richard Law stated, I live on the front lot of Bay Front Court, which faced the water for about 12 years. I have to say the amount of traffic that went by my house, maybe 58 or 100 cars a day, we are speaking here of putting in a road to let these boats come in once in the fall over a two, three week period and then go out again in the spring. Once in and once out.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, I think we have heard enough tonight on this. I don’t think we have enough information here to vote on this tonight anyway. I think if you two can get together and try to develop a plan and give them name to have a meeting with and see if you can get together and see what you can agree with on this. I think we would all be a lot better off. As far as shutting her building down and shutting her business down I don’t think we will do that right tonight. As far as the fine we will discuss that at the next meeting. If we can get the drainage plan and how much property you want to rezone and in her commitment how many buildings you are wanting to put up. If she goes beyond that she would have to come back to the board.

 

Ruth Bortscheller stated, do we agree that the building can not be built it is at a stand still.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, I don’t think we can stop that.

 

Don Ward stated, we can’t stop that.

 

David Rosenbarger stated, it can be built, it can only be used for…

 

President Charles Anderson stated, boats can not go in it, it can not be used as part of the business and if you see that you can come before the area plan office.

 

Ruth Bortscheller asked, so when is the next meeting?

 

President Charles Anderson asked, do we have a motion to table this?

 

Don Ward stated, I make a motion that we table this.

 

Jay Clawson stated, I will second it.

 

Several are talking at once.

 

Director Weaver stated, the next months meeting is December 12.

 

President Charles Anderson asked, do you agree with this?

 

Melanie Green stated, we don’t have much say so, we just have to go with what you are telling us. We will have to go for another month and by that time Jim Milligan said he would have the drainage plan done.

 

President Charles Anderson stated, I would get on him to get that done quick.

 

Several are talking at once.

 

Attorney Altman stated, the commitment you presented tonight has some defects and as I understood the last time that we would have that ahead of time so I can look at it. They are not big or serious, but there are several things that need to be done. If you can get that to me say a week before the meeting so I can review it and have a chance to and Diann can look at it, we won’t have to table it again. You need to get with the neighbors right away.

 

Director Weaver stated, if we have that two weeks before the meeting we can mail a copy to the board so they can be familiar with it as well.

 

Several are talking at once.

 

Jay Clawson asked, do you have a plan, I mean do you plan on putting one more building up?

 

Melanie Green stated, no we don’t have a plan, it is just being in this business and it was apparent to us that when we bought all of the buildings they were full. We are from the lakes and we have our own friends that would like to store with us. That is why we are asking for the next building.

 

Jay Clawson stated, I understand that, but what we are kind of asking and what they are to is there is a density where you get over populated and the building you are building now and if in your commitment maybe in the future that there is going to be one more building maybe built and then they won’t have to worry about you building 5 buildings or you sell it 10 years from now that is all that can be built is one more building. They would have to come back and redo the commitment to actually add more density to that, there fore no building can just show up in October. Mr. Burke isn’t that what you wanted.

 

Tom Burke stated, I’m not trying to oppose it, I think if it were you know I’ve looked at these storage things before, I know probably a lot about them. I think if they were done property accordingly and property and limited I mean 2’ from or 10’ from each other and the traffic that is in it. If you subdivide them and put more in them like Geise Reservoir and Morris Reservoir.

 

Melanie Green stated, part of the building permit stated that this would not be for public use building. This is full service where people will drop the boat off and we put them in the building, so in no way shape or form are we having a you store business, that is not what it is. That is never going to be the use in the future.

 

Attorney Altman stated, you need to put that in the commitment.

 

Director Weaver asked, does the board want the fence to be included on the commitment?

 

Several answered yes.

 

Ken Green stated, I just have one question, will the board just be wanting fence over anything driveable so people won’t pass through the neighborhood. You can’t drive through the woods.

 

Several stated you can have trees, bushes, etc.

 

David Rosenbarger stated, it is more visual.

 

Ken Green stated, so a fence from the back of the building and a chain across that we can take our mowers through.

 

Jay Clawson stated, a gate or something.

 

Director Weaver stated, contact me at the office and I can give you copy out of the ordinance.

 

****

#892 Troy M. & Angela G. Hartzler; The property is located on Lots 22 & 23 in the Original Plat in the Town of Chalmers, located at 114 E. Main Street.

Violation: None

Request: They are requesting to rezone from B-1 to B-2.

President Charles Anderson asked, do we have someone here representing this request?

Troy Hartzler stated, Troy Hartzler.

President Charles Anderson asked, does anyone have any questions about this request? Is there anyone in the audience with any questions?

Director Weaver stated, I have not talked to anyone.

President Charles Anderson asked, do any of the Commissioners have any request? If not I say that we vote.

The results of the vote were as follows: 9 affirmative and 0 negative. This will be presented to the Town board of Chalmers for their action.

****

President Charles Anderson stated, next on the agenda would be Subdivisions and we do not have any. So we go to business we have Rangeline Properties. Is there someone here to give us an update on Rangeline Properties?

Attorney Altman stated, the only thing that I can tell you there is as a consequence of the bins I know that is not the right word, but the steel structures that are on there and not removed we sent them a letter, the owner a letter demanding that they as we said they had 30 days after the action of the Commissioners final on this. We sent them the demand letter to remove it and it was not removed and I have proceeded to file suit on that in White Superior Court. We have received an answer from their attorney Dow Dellinger and we are in the process of proceeding with litigation on that.

President Charles Anderson stated, as far as the litigation do we have a fine that we can put on them per day that they stay there.

Attorney Altman stated, we have incorporated that within our complaint and it is in Court. The violation.

President Charles Anderson asked, so it has to go to court before we can do that?

Director Weaver stated, we already fined him $500.

Attorney Altman stated, yes we did that, but if it continues the judge can in fact impose a fine based upon our ordinance, so yes it can go above and beyond that.

President Charles Anderson asked, does anyone in the audience want to say anything about that?

Director Weaver stated, I have also received a complaint that they are using the corner lot on the South side and storing some business equipment on that property on and off, not on a regular or consistent basis on and off. I have some pictures that have been provided to me and I have been monitoring that property and investigating it at this time. It would really help if I knew exactly where the property line was. When you are at the property it is hard to tell exactly where the line is. At this time it is hard to say.

Don Pauken stated, I want to make a correct first. It has been filed in Circuit Court, not Superior Court. What I want to know is how is this complaint the defendants answer to the complaint how is that handled. Mr. Dellinger has answered the summons if you will in the case and also he has answered it with this Defendants answer to the complaint and I won’t tell you my opinion of it, but how is this taken care of.

Attorney Altman stated, it is set for Discovery and then for trial. The judge decides based on the pleadings and the evidence that he receives in the case as to the decision and disposal of the case. The judge decides that and that is all there is.

Don Pauken stated, you don’t have to answer this, answer any of this complaint?

Attorney Altman stated, not an answer you don’t respond to it.

President Charles Anderson stated, other than court.

Attorney Altman stated, other than do a discovery work finding out a ledge and lease and as I suggested earlier I need to talk to Mr. Dellinger more about that formally and then get answers and then proceed to court, yes.

President Charles Anderson stated, I say we need to do that as quick as we can because this has been going on to long.

Attorney Altman stated, I agree.

Bill Pyle stated, Bill Pyle, there was some kind of problem that this went to Hookers the previous owner the letter that was sent. What is this office over here that sends those notices out?

Attorney Altman stated, I prepared the summons and the summons by law is required by law to go to the resident agent. The resident agent is listed in the Secretary State’s office and that is exactly who I served on that.

Bill Pyle stated, that is the previous owner, are you aware of that.

Attorney Altman stated, well I can tell you that maybe, but that isn’t or doesn’t change the requirement of the Statue.

Bill Pyle asked, what do you mean it doesn’t, well I mean, why would it go to the previous owner?

Attorney Altman stated, because someone didn’t change the resident agent is all I can tell you. In other words if they had changed it to somebody that they should have it would have caused it to be sent to the owners.

Bill Pyle stated, the owner of the property is the one that is responsible for that, not the resident agent.

Attorney Altman stated, the owner of the corporation is, but if you were named on that at one time as a resident agent we unfortunately would have to serve you.

Bill Pyle asked, are you aware that is the previous owner?

Attorney Altman stated, yes, I was amazed to find out that he was still listed as the resident agent.

Bill Pyle stated, I didn’t know whether reading the transcript back from Dellinger and where they accept part of the responsibility and then they are talking about someone who is leasing the property or…

Attorney Altman stated, yes, that.

Bill Pyle stated, this, your deal is out there in limbo there is no one accepted it right.

Attorney Altman stated, yes with an appearance and an answer it certainly is.

Bill Pyle stated, the answer from Dellinger is.

Attorney Altman stated, yes, the appearance and the answer it certainly does it bring it to point.

President Charles Anderson asked, do have any more questions out there? Does the board have any questions? Do we have any other business?

Jay Clawson stated, are we done with Rangeline? Brad Smock asked if he could talk to the board. He has a couple of questions that he would like to ask. I just ask that you give him a few minutes.

Brad Smock stated, I apologize the way this was handled. We went in to get a building permit with Diann to build a house and now we have to get a variance because I own a hog farm also. I’m building my house to close to my hog farm on a different piece of property. So really I have to get a variances against my self. The reason this screws me up is because if I don’t do it, my house will cost my $70,000 more, so that is why I can’t wait until the next one. If I had to build the basement of my house, they won’t pour the basement in December and so if go ahead and build the basement anyway I mean do I just pay a fine and build my basement, those are my questions I guess.

Director Weaver stated, he would be dealing with the BZA on that.

Brad Smock stated, on which one.

Director Weaver stated, on the variance and the fine.

Brad Smock stated, right, but do I really get a variance against myself. I know I have talked to Huffer from Carroll County today and he said there isn’t such a thing. I mean I can’t build a hog barn beside your house, which that is understandable. If I want to build a house beside my own hog barn.

Director Weaver stated, it is in the White County Ordinance.

Brad Smock stated, I know that is what I’m saying.

President Charles Anderson stated, if you sold that piece of property then it would be next to a hog barn and as far as we can’t give you a variance here.

Brad Smock stated, right I understand that.

President Charles Anderson stated, but…

Greg Bossaer stated, if he was wanting to do that on the other piece of property there would be no problem.

Brad Smock stated, it is still within the 1300’.

Director Weaver stated, on the property with the confinement building?

Greg Bossaer stated, yes.

Director Weaver stated, correct, but there is already a home on that property. Isn’t there?

Brad Smock stated, yes, that was the first thing and then I would have to tear down my house now, so we just went over and deeded off another corner and left a separation between the two, so we could go ahead and build our house before we have to pay the surcharge. I own the section in the middle and my dad owns around me, so we just put 20’ of my Dad’s in between my hog farm and where we are building our new house.

President Charles Anderson stated, the only trouble with going ahead would be if you didn’t happen to get it.

Brad Smock stated, I’m not going to fight myself for the variance.

Several are talking at once.

Director Weaver stated, even if there isn’t anyone opposing the variance the board can still deny it.

Brad Smock stated, yes, but that would be the chance I take.

President Charles Anderson stated, that would be the chance he would take.

Brad Smock stated, if I pay a fine for doing my basement then I pay a fine for doing my basement. I know I’ve got to do that because the house is going to cost me $70,000 more if I wait for the other thing.

David Scott asked, Diann will he have to give notice if he waits to get a variance does he have to give notice to anyone else besides himself?

Director Weaver stated, notice will have to be given to whoever is across the road also.

President Charles Anderson asked, who is across the road from you?

Brad Smock stated, John Scott.

Director Weaver stated, we go a complete circle around the property.

Brad Smock stated, even though the variance is because of my hog barn, you still have to tell it to everyone around you.

Director Weaver stated, yes.

Brad Smock stated, the variance is caused if it wasn’t for my hog barn there wouldn’t need to be a variance. We never found this out until we went to get the building permit and we are thinking okay they are going to come do the basement next week.

Director Weaver stated, have you applied for the permit, I wasn’t aware that you had applied.

Brad Smock stated, well that is what we went in to do when it all happened.

Director Weaver stated, but you haven’t actually applied for the permit.

Brad Smock stated, I couldn’t tell you.

Director Weaver stated, I don’t believe that I have seen any paperwork.

Brad Smock stated, okay, so I don’t know about that one.

David Scott stated, my question would be if he came to BZA Thursday night.

Attorney Altman stated, that is what I was going to suggest has Diann seen, that is the body you need to talk to about this. This body is of course…

President Charles Anderson asked, how long ago did you start this process?

Brad Smock stated, for building a house.

President Charles Anderson stated, yes.

Brad Smock stated, 3 months ago.

President Charles Anderson stated, 3 months ago and at the time that you went to separate this piece of property off did you tell, or was that through area plan or where did you go to.

Director Weaver stated, we don’t get any notice when they split property.

Brad Smock stated, I don’t know.

President Charles Anderson stated, I would go to the BZA and I wold talk to any landowner that might effect you around there, but we can’t tell you to go ahead and build that.

Brad Smock stated, right, I understand that. Can I come to Thursday even though I’m not on the agenda, when I talked to you Diann didn’t you say I had to submit everything and then wait until the December meeting.

Director Weaver stated, to file the actual request, yes.

President Charles Anderson stated, you can request to talk the board, just like you came to ask here. We’ve got to board members on here that might give you permission to get on the docket, I don’t know if I can or not.

Brad Smock stated, another part that throws it off is if I have to get the variance, then if I have to get the variance because I’m by the hog farm then it throws me into a commercial loan instead of a residential loan. That means you’ve got to pay for your house in 7 years instead of 30 years.

President Charles Anderson asked, do the BZA members have any objections?

David Scott stated, I don’t have any objections to it. I won’t guarantee the out come.

Brad Smock stated, I can come Thursday. Do you want me to bring…

Gary Barber stated, I would suggest that you get a hold of your neighbors.

Several are talking at once.

Gary Barber stated, I would make contact with them and get a statement so they know what is going on.

Brad Smock stated, I know I won’t object and I’m sure they won’t either, I’ve lived there for 32 years now, so…I will be there Thursday. I agree why you don’t want one beside your house, but if I’m dumb enough to build a house beside the hog house.

Director Weaver stated, the meeting starts at 7:30 and business is at the end. I have several on the agenda. They lock the doors at 8:00.

Brad Smock asked, can I just bring a letter or something from the landowners around me?

President Charles Anderson stated, I would bring in anything you’ve got.

Several are talking at once.

David Scott stated, the only thing I might see is what you said about getting a loan, a letter from your loan institute, in loaning this money not knowing that it is right next to a hog operation.

Brad Smock stated, that has already been taken care of.

David Scott stated, okay you might bring some documentation so that they realize.

Brad Smock stated, you mean bring something to you.

David Scott stated, to the meeting. We have an obligation to protect them to so they know what they are getting into.

Brad Smock stated, okay.

Gary Barber stated, letter from the loan officer.

Brad Smock stated, saying it is not going to be a commercial loan.

David Scott stated, no just that they understand that you are building a house next to a hog operation.

Brad Smock stated, all right.

David Scott stated, if you default and they realize the risk that they are taking also.

Attorney Altman stated, good point, they need to know.

Brad Smock stated, okay bring a letter to the bank and bring.

David Scott stated, anything like that.

Several are talking at once.

President Charles Anderson stated, we still have a business here.

Director Weaver stated, I’ve given you a copy of a letter I received in the office regarding street names. This goes with the address ordinance that was done, I can’t even tell you when it was done. It says 1991. We have someone here in the County as you can see from the letter that is wanting to change the name of the street. When she first approached us, I told her we did not deal with this, she went tot he county commissioners and they decided to amend this addressing ordinance and put Area Plan in charge of road names. So we therefore need to adopted a policy of how we want to handle this, if we want fees imposed, we just need to come up with a policy.

President Charles Anderson asked, is there just one person on this road?

Director Weaver stated, I included a map of the road. There are three houses on the road now.

President Charles Anderson stated, they would all have to agree to it.

Director Weaver stated, basically what I have done is put together a packet of the ordinance, she had sent me a copy of Tippecanoe County’s which I don’t completely understand, but I’m giving this to you so you can look it over and discuss it at the next meeting and have some ideas so we can start adopting a policy on how we want to handle this situation.

President Charles Anderson stated, we will send it back tot he Commissioners.

Director Weaver stated, they’ve already dumped it on us.

Several are talking at once.

Gary Barbour asked, who owns the road, they are saying they own the road?

Director Weaver stated, they are saying they own the road. They are saying they own it.

President Charles Anderson asked, is everyone on the road agreeing to change it?

Director Weaver stated, as far as I know the neighbors aren’t even aware of this at this point.

Several are talking at once.

Director Weaver stated, I also want to mention to the board that there are some changes going on in the office. Cindy Hall has left the office, she is no longer employed with Area Plan. She is with the Clerk’s office. They are also getting ready to do a remodel, going to expand the office area to include the Building Department.

The meeting adjourned.

Respectfully submitted,

Donald W. Ward, Secretary

White County Area Plan Commission

Diann Weaver, Director

White County Area Plan Commission