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The White County Board of Zoning Appeals met on Thursday, November 18, 2004 at 7:30 p.m. in the Commissioners’ Meeting Room, Second Floor, County Building, Monticello, Indiana.

Members attending were Gary Barbour, David Scott, Carol Stradling, Jerry Thompson and David Stimmel. Also attending was Director Diann Weaver.

Visitors attending were: Emory M. Lock, Charles Mellon, Mark N. Burrows, Perry McWilliams, Dan Boian, Susie Boian, Beverly Burrows, Mike Werner, Joe Chilcott, John Sayler, Ethan White, Josey Walters, Daniel Walters, Mike White, Dan Harvey, Jerry Lombardi, Kathleen Lombardi, Christine Walsh, Eric Holt, Carol Smoot, James Crum and Mary Crum. Not signed in but in attendance were Tom Fee and his wife.

The meeting was called to order by President Jerry Thompson and roll call was taken. Attorney Altman swore in all Board members and audience members.

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#2377 John Sayler; 1980 Mobile Home.

Violation: None.

Request: He is requesting a Special Exception to allow a mobile home older than a 1981 to be located within White County. Section 12.00, Article 12.10 of the White County Zoning Ordinance requires that any mobile home older than a 1981 have an inspection done and an approved special exception in order to be placed in White County.

President Jerry Thompson asked, is there anyone here representing this variance?

John Sayler stated, I’m John Sayler.

President Jerry Thompson asked, do you have anything that you would like to add?

John Sayler stated, no sir.

President Jerry Thompson stated, nothing, okay. Diann do you have anything pertaining to this?

Director Weaver stated, no I do not.



President Jerry Thompson asked, does anyone here care to address the variance either for or


against? Any comments or questions from the board? We will start with you Carol.

Carol Stradling stated, my only question is on #2 on Mr. Braaksma’s report it indicates that he found, the only problem found was an open circuit in the outlet on the wall between the bathroom and the bedroom. Have you seen the report Mr. Sayler?

John Sayler stated, yes.

Carol Stradling stated, okay. I don’t know if that has been fixed or can you tell me anything about that.

Joe Chilcott stated, I’m Joe Chilcott and I believe that they took that fixture out of there.

Carol Stradling stated, okay.

President Jerry Thompson asked, Mr. Chilcott your relationship to Mr. Sayler?

Joe Chilcott stated, I’m partners with him on the trailer.

President Jerry Thompson asked, you are co-owner?

Joe Chilcott stated, yes.

President Jerry Thompson stated, okay. Anything else Carol?

Carol Stradling stated, I don’t know, would we have a picture of that do you know. It is between the bedroom and bathroom wall. Usually he takes a picture of a problem and I’m not seeing that.

President Jerry Thompson asked, are you aware of anything Diann?

Director Weaver stated, no, I’m not.

Carol Stradling stated, I guess I just want to make sure that it is taken care of before we would...

David Scott asked, does he come back for an inspection after a final inspection after everything is done?

Director Weaver stated, usually if the board wants that done they will make it.

David Scott stated, it says he that he needs a smoke detector.

President Jerry Thompson stated, so do you suggest that we address the variance pending another inspection.

Carol Stradling stated, make it conditional.

President Jerry Thompson asked, do you suggest that.

Director Weaver stated, normally that is what you ask.

Carol Stradling stated, I don’t if we have ever looked at one of these that didn’t need anything that had to go back and be checked.

President Jerry Thompson asked, is that agreeable with the others on the board?

Carol Stradling stated, I would move that we vote on this with a condition that there be a re-inspection and that the items noted on Mr. Braaksma’s report concerning the open circuit and the smoke detector be repaired.

President Jerry Thompson asked, what is your concern Dave?

David Stimmel stated, well there was mention of installation in the back that he said was a problem also.

President Jerry Thompson stated, okay. You need to include that in your motion obviously.

Carol Stradling stated, okay.

David Stimmel stated, I will second that.

President Jerry Thompson stated, it has been moved and seconded. All of those in favor signify by saying “aye” and all of those opposed. Motion carried by a 5 to 0 vote.

President Jerry Thompson asked, is there anymore discussion? If not is the board ready to vote?

Without further discussion the board voted.

The Board finds the following:

1. That the report from the inspection was provided and covers all required areas, see file for exhibit.

2. That no objectors were present at the meeting.

3. That proper notice was given by newspaper advertisement.

4. That the request is for a special exception to allow a 1980 Mobile Home to be brought into White County as required by Section 12.00 of the White County Zoning Ordinance.

5. That the variance herein authorized and granted is not so typical or recurrent in nature as to make reasonable practicable the formulation of a general regulation under an amendment of the ordinance for the above said improvement, and the Board additionally finds that the above said variance is based on the findings of fact so made that are required to be made under the provisions of Section 10.20 of the White County Zoning Ordinance, said findings of fact support and create a fact situation that authorizes the above said variance under the above said section of zoning ordinance.

The variance was granted based on the findings of fact by a vote of 5 affirmative and 0 negative.

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#2378 Mark R. Burrows, Owner; Beverly Burrows, Applicant; The property is located on Lot 51 and Part of Lots 6, 15, 16, 17 and 50 in Block B, in Headlee at 11030 E. Pennsylvania Street.

Violation: None

Request: They are requesting a 32’ front (from Washington St.) setback variance and a 12’ front (from Pennsylvania St.) setback variance to put up a 6’ privacy fence on the property.

President Jerry Thompson asked, is there anyone here representing the Burrows?

Mark Burrows stated, I’m Mark Burrows.

President Jerry Thompson stated, okay, you are the owner. Do you have anything that you would like to present other than what I have read?

Mark Burrows stated, yes, the reason for the variance is I don’t have a whole lot of property. I have six children. There is an existing fence post back there and my wife put grape vines and flowers and things like that around and we would like to keep that and just run it off of that. Without losing all of that property to the back.

President Jerry Thompson stated, okay for the benefit of the board would you point that marker out. We have a survey let Carol show you the survey and point that out.

Mark Burrows is currently going over the survey with Carol.

David Scott asked, you own parts of these lots, am I looking at that right.

Mark Burrows is going over the survey with Dave Scott at this point.

Mark Burrows stated, my neighbor built what you call a hillbilly fence and when he got a survey he found out that he was on my property and now he has trees planted on my land and I really want the privacy fence. There wasn’t a problem with it running this way, but there was here because of the road.

David Scott stated, this little section here, is that the lot line there.

Mark Burrows stated, yes.

David Scott asked, do you own that?

Mark Burrows stated, yes.

David Scott asked, does that belong to someone on 16?

Mark Burrows stated, no, that would be the lot line.

Carol Stradling asked, so are the trees, these little, are those yours or are those his?

Mark Burrows stated, yes.

Carol Stradling asked, so you want the fence between you and the trees?

Mark Burrows stated, yes.

Carol Stradling stated, I’m looking at a picture here. Is that the corner post that you are looking at?

Mark Burrows stated, yes, I’ve got grapevines planted in here. I see where you saw the little trees.

Currently going over the pictures.

President Jerry Thompson asked, Diann do you have anything you want to mention on this?

Director Weaver stated, no I do not.

David Scott asked, is this fence going clear out to the street?

Director Weaver stated, yes.

Carol Stradling stated, I think it is going up to the right-of-way. Dave look at the lower picture that is the fence post he is talking about and then there is the road.

David Scott stated, oh okay.

President Jerry Thompson asked, are there anymore questions for Mr. Burrows while we have him here? Does anyone else care to address the variance either for or against?

David Stimmel asked, Mr. Burrows when you got the survey are these lines for the fence drawn in by the surveyor or by you?

Mark Burrows stated, no I didn’t draw on there.

David Stimmel stated, I’m with Dave Scott I’m concerned that you are covering lot 8. Oh it says part of 6, 15,16,17 & 50, okay that is what I was trying to find out.

President Jerry Thompson asked, is there anything else?

Carol Stradling stated, okay it is going to be 6’ and I guess I’m not real clear where it is going to go. It is not going around your house. It is going to go where these square posts are. So the fence will go from this corner back to here.

Mark Burrows stated, well this is undecided. I’ve got a lady who is in her 80’s who lives next door to me. She loves to watch my children play in the yard so I agreed that I will leave this open so she can watch my kids play. What I want to do, this is an existing fence I want to build it here and here coming this way. I don’t want to build anything here and where the barn is bring it down from the corner and bring it right back.

Carol Stradling asked, all you need the variance for is this.

Mark Burrows stated, right.

Director Weaver stated, and for the front on Pennsylvania.

Mark Burrows stated, that is something I will do down the road or maybe not, it not something that I desire at this point.

President Jerry Thompson asked, is there anything else Carol?

Carol Stradling stated, no.

President Jerry Thompson asked, any other concerns?

Without further discussion the board voted.

The Board finds the following:

1. That the property is properly zoned R-2, One and Two Family Residential.


2. That the lot was an existing lot of record at the time of enactment of the ordinance, as defined in Section 2.114.


3. That the site plan survey provided shows the lot size, existing improvements and proposed improvements, see file for exhibit.


4. That no objectors were present at the meeting.

5. That proper notice was given by mail to adjoining property owners.


6. That the request is for a 32’ front (from Washington St.) setback variance and a 12’ front (from Pennsylvania St.) setback variance to put up a 6’ privacy fence on Lot Numbered Fifteen (15), Sixteen (16) and Seventeen (17) in Block “B” of the Original Plat of the Town of Headlee, White County, Indiana, EXCEPT the following: Fifty Four (54) feet off the East end of Lots Numbered Fifteen (15), Sixteen (16) and Seventeen (17) in Block “B” of the Original Plat of the Town of Headlee, White County, Indiana. ALSO, Lots Numbered Six (6), Fifty (50) and Fifty One (51) in Block “B” in the Original Plat of the Town of Headlee, White County, Indiana, EXCEPT the following: Ninety Five and One Half (95 ½) feet off the West end of Lots Numbered Six (6) and Fifty (50) in Block “B” in the Original Plat of the Town of Headlee, White County, Indiana.

COMMON DESCRIPTION: The property is located in Headlee at 11030 E. Pennsylvania Street.


7. That the variances herein authorized and granted are not so typical or recurrent in nature as to make reasonable practicable the formulation of a general regulation under an amendment of the ordinance for the above said specific piece of property, and the Board additionally finds that the above said variances are based on the findings of fact so made that are required to be made under the provisions of Section 10.10 of the White County Zoning Ordinance, said findings of fact support and create a fact situation that authorizes the above said variances under the above said sections of the zoning ordinance.

The variance was granted based on the findings of fact by a vote of 5 affirmative and 0 negative.


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#2379 June L. & Larry L. Lock; The property is located on Lot 16 on Market Street in Hinkle’s Addition, in the Town of Monon at 104 W. Brook Street.

Violation: None

Request: They are requesting a 9’ (from the 2’ eave) front setback variance (from Brook Street) to build a detached garage.

President Jerry Thompson asked, is there anyone here representing this request?

Emory Lock stated, I’m Emory Lock.

President Jerry Thompson asked, do you know who this man is?

Director Weaver stated, no, I believe the property is in the name of June & Larry Lock.

President Jerry Thompson stated, yes, that is the only reason why I’m questioning you. What is your relationship to June and Larry?

Emory Lock stated, I’m husband to June and father to Larry.

President Jerry Thompson stated, okay. Is there anyone here with you that is one or the other? We want to make sure.

June Lock stated, I’m June Lock, I own the house.

President Jerry Thompson stated, okay you do not have to come forwards. This man is?

June Lock stated, my husband for 54 years.

President Jerry Thompson stated, that is great. He can speak for you obviously. Sorry about that sir we just have to be careful. Okay do you have anything that you would like to add?

Emory Lock stated, no.

President Jerry Thompson asked, Diann do you have anything on this?

Director Weaver stated, no I do not. I just might add that this is on the corner of the State Highway that goes through Monon and one of the city streets.

Carol Stradling stated, it appears that the house and the shed are encroaching on the alley. Is that true?

Director Weaver stated, according to the survey it is.

Carol Stradling stated, that is not what we are addressing tonight.

Director Weaver stated, no they are not making any changes to my knowledge to the house or the shed.

President Jerry Thompson asked, is that correct?

Emory Lock stated, yes.

President Jerry Thompson asked, does anyone care to address the variance either for or against? Dave Scott I will start with you.

David Scott stated, I don’t have anything.

President Jerry Thompson stated, Dave Stimmel?

David Stimmel stated, no.

President Jerry Thompson asked, Gary and Carol?

Carol Stradling stated, I’m just trying to look at the picture and figure out which way it is. I’ve got it now.

Director Weaver stated, the house faces Brook St.

Carol Stradling asked, even though it looks like they encroach on the alley, they do not, they encroach on the alleyway not on the alley?

Director Weaver stated, right.

Carol Stradling stated, there is a concrete slab to the East.

June Lock stated, yes, that is where an old gas station used to be years ago.

Carol Stradling stated, in the pictures it looks very close to your property, but it is not on your property.

June Lock stated, yes from the side to the highway to the alley is supposed to be all of mine.

Carol Stradling stated, so there is a slab with a trailer setting on it. Is that yours?

June Lock stated, we have a car carrier.

Carol Stradling stated, that slab is on your property or that trailer is on a slab on your property?

June Lock stated, yes.

David Scott stated, that is where the garage is suppose to go where that car carrier is setting.

Carol Stradling stated, that is what I was looking at Dave trying to figure out how close it would be to that slab on the corner. All right Dave maybe you can help me. I’m looking at their property being on the corner of Market and Brook. Then I’m looking at the slab from the old gas station.

David Scott stated, the lots run East and West. 60 x 120. The gas station, their house actually sets on the back end of that lot. This slab that you are looking at is on the front of the lot.

Carol Stradling stated, so the whole slab, the gas station thing is on their lot.

David Scott stated, yes.

David Stimmel stated, some of it is probably on the right-of-way. It has been there a long time.

Carol Stradling stated, I just didn’t see room for a gas station lot between their property and the road.

President Jerry Thompson asked, is there anything else Carol?

Carol Stradling stated, no.

President Jerry Thompson asked, are there any other concerns?

Without further discussion the board voted.

The Board finds the following:

1. That the property is properly zoned R-2, One and Two Family Residential.

2. That the lot was an existing lot of record at the time of enactment of the ordinance, as defined in Section 2.114.

3. That the site plan survey provided shows the lot size, existing improvements and proposed improvements, see file for exhibit.

4. That no objectors were present at the meeting.

5. That proper notice was given by mail to adjoining property owners.

6. That the request is for a 9’ (from the 2’ eave) front setback variance (from Brook Street) to build a detached garage on Lot Number Sixteen (16) on Market Street in Hinkle’s Addition to the Original Plat of the Town of New Bradford, now Monon, Indiana.

COMMON DESCRIPTION: The property is located in the Town of Monon at 104 W. Brook Street.

7. That the variance herein authorized and granted is not so typical or recurrent in nature as to make typical or recurrent the formulation of a general regulation under an amendment of the ordinance for the above said condition or situation of the above said specific piece of property, and the Board additionally finds that the above said variance is based on the findings of fact so made that are required to be made under the provisions of Section 10.10 of the White County Zoning Ordinance, said findings of fact support and create a fact situation that authorizes the above said variance under the above said sections of the zoning ordinance.

The variance was granted based on the findings of fact by a vote of 5 affirmative and 0 negative.

****

#2380 Randall J. & Diane J. Leise, Owner; Eric Holt, Applicant; The property is located on .043 of an acre more or less and also Lot Number Seven (7) in Cedar Point Subdivision, South of Monticello at 5724 E. Cedar Point Court.

Violation: None

Request: They are requesting a 25’ (from eave) front setback variance to build an addition and to bring the existing home into compliance.


President Jerry Thompson asked, anyone here representing this variance?


Eric Holt stated, I’m Eric Holt.


President Jerry Thompson stated, Eric Holt, you are the applicant.


Director Weaver stated, we do have in the file a letter from the owner giving Mr. Holt permission to represent him.


Eric Holt stated, they are requesting as you can see from the plat, you guys have a surveyor. There is an existing sunroom on the back and Diann forgive me I just caught this, but should we be requesting for a 15’ instead of a 25’. Did we word that right?


Director Weaver asked, you are going from the water's edge?


Eric Holt stated, from the property line, which is out in the water.


Director Weaver stated, or the waters edge which ever is closer. We have requested that from the water's edge.


Eric Holt stated, okay so that is what the 6’.


Director Weaver stated, that is why he put that on there for us.


Eric Holt stated, there is a sunroom on the back and he is going to redo the roof on it. It is a shed roof right now and he is also going to widen it so it is more a part of the house. The shed roof and it steps down from the main part of the house and it is just an attachment. Once it is re-done it will be more usable space and livable in the house.


President Jerry Thompson stated, so basically you are saying it is a sunroom.


Eric Holt stated, yes.


President Jerry Thompson asked, Diann do you have anything else to add to this?


Director Weaver stated, no, other than we has had some calls in the office regarding this request from some neighbors that had concerns. I don’t know if any of them are here this evening.


President Jerry Thompson asked, anyone else care to address this?


Mike Warner stated, I’m Mike Warner and I’m one of the neighbors with a concern.


President Jerry Thompson stated, okay and you are located where.


Mike Warner stated, 5717 Cedar Point Court, I’m two doors West.


President Jerry Thompson stated, okay two doors West.


Mike Warner stated, okay this sunroom that was my concerns. My understanding was they were just going to square it up with the building and now they are talking about changing the roofline. Well I have a view of the lake over the existing roof. This sunroom is grandfathered in, in other words you couldn’t get a permit to build it there now. It is there and it is grandfathered. The roofline should be grandfathered too. That is my concern because I have a view over that roofline if he changes that roofline it will completely block my view of the lake. I want to build a deck on the front of my house and I won’t have any view, that is my concern. When I talked to Randy last week he said he didn’t know if he was going up or out or back yet, he hadn’t decided, so that is why I’m here and concerned.


President Jerry Thompson stated, okay, thank you.


Eric Holt asked, can I address that?


President Jerry Thompson stated, just a second please. I’ve got a question here my self first. Just so I get an understanding here. That gentleman that just spoke he is in relationship, he is to the left or the right of our survey.


Director Weaver stated, he is to the left of the survey.


President Jerry Thompson stated, he is to the left from the water looking in your are to the left of this.


Mike Warner stated, correct.


President Jerry Thompson asked, please come forward. Is your house in any of these photos?


Director Weaver stated, look at the top right one.


President Jerry Thompson asked, are you in this one here.


Mike Warner stated, no.


Director Weaver stated, are you behind it.


Mike Warner stated, I’m behind it. Pass the tree is my door.


President Jerry Thompson asked, would you point out to the board your relationship. They have the same photos.


Mike Warner stated, in this picture you can barely see my front door. I set up a little bit higher then his. I can stand in my door and look right over this roofline. That is the only picture that shows any of my property.


President Jerry Thompson asked, you are the contractor?


Eric Holt stated, I’m the architect.


President Jerry Thompson stated, you would like to respond to his concerns.


Eric Holt stated, just to give you an idea of what we are doing. He is putting a gable roof over the top of the sunroom that runs in the same direction as the gable of the house. The peak of the gable is going to be below the existing house, but it is going to bring it out.


Mike Warner stated, I barely have a view over that flat roof. That gable is my concern raising that.


President Jerry Thompson asked, again sir you are lot 24? Do you know roughly?


Mike Warner stated, no, my address is 5714. I can’t tell you for sure.


Director Weaver asked, what is your address again?


Mike Warner stated, 5714.


President Jerry Thompson asked, does anyone else care to address the variance? Carol we will start with you do you have any questions for Mr. Holt?


Carol Stradling stated not really, I’m looking at this lower right picture and it would have been taken from the perspective of about Mr. Warner’s lot and I can see there.


Mike Warner stated, that is taken from the opposite direction, none of those are from my lot.


Director Weaver stated, it is taken by the house next door.


Mike Warner stated, no the picture is taken from the house East of him.


Director Weaver stated, no, there is a picture here from the West, but it is not from his property, it is from the adjacent property.


President Jerry Thompson asked, do you want us to come back to you Carol?


Carol Stradling stated, go ahead.


President Jerry Thompson asked, Gary any questions?


Gary Barbour stated, no.


President Jerry Thompson asked, Dave Scott?


David Scott stated, it appears that you are just wanting to make the room wider and you are not lengthening it out any.


Eric Holt stated, no, we are not going any closer to the front of the property.


David Scott stated, they are wanting to eliminate the flat roof. That is what they are wanting to do. Could they go ahead and do this and leave the roofline the way it is?


Eric Holt stated, because of the floor elevation, we’ve got to raise the floor up, there is not enough room to get heating ducks in there and already because of the sloped roof it is only about 6’ to the edge of that. When we take that roof off we are going to build the wall height up so it is even with the rest of the house at 8’, so when you walk from the existing house into the sunroom, the floor is going to be the same level and the ceiling will be the same height also. We are also going to run the heat ducks for that room up into the attic.


Mike Warner stated, I think if he just raised the floor and left the flat roof on it he is going to raise the roof without putting a gable on it.


Erick Holt stated, if we raise the floor and not move the roof at all then it is going to put the outside wall.


Mike Warner stated, that is exactly my point, it you start raising the roof it is going to block my view. If that room wasn’t there, you wouldn’t be able to get a permit for it now because it is too close to the water, it is grandfathered in.


Director Weaver stated, he could go through the variance process.


Eric Holt stated, that is part of why we are here tonight is to bring the house into compliance also.


Mike Warner stated, so we would have to go through this again exactly.


President Jerry Thompson asked, is there anything else Dave Scott?


David Scott stated, no.


President Jerry Thompson asked, David Stimmel anything?


David Stimmel stated, I’m kind of in favor of tabling it to be honest with you and go out and look at it. Just a thought.


President Jerry Thompson asked, is there anyone else?


Carol Stradling stated, we could look at what view we are blocking and if there are any other options.


President Jerry Thompson asked, is time an issue?


Eric Holt stated, Randy would like to have or be under construction right now. We were waiting to get the variance here so we can apply for the permit. He has got the house cleared out right now and we’ve got contractors ready to get going on it.


Mike Warner stated, this is not a permanent residence. It is a vacation home.


Eric Holt stated, it is a vacation home for Randy right now. They are going to use it during the summer and he is going to retire too eventually. We would have gotten the building permit already had we not had to apply for the variance.


President Jerry Thompson asked, what is the board’s wishes? Mr. Stimmel asked that we table it to give us a chance to take a look at this.


Carol Stradling asked, do you want to put that in a form of a motion?


David Stimmel stated, I move that we table this variance so we have an opportunity to go out and see what the true issue is.


Carol Stradling stated, I will second that.


President Jerry Thompson stated, it has been moved and second. All in favor signify by saying “aye” and all opposed. Motion carried variance is tabled until the December 16, 2004 meeting.


****

#2381 Daniel Lee Harvey; The property is located on Lots 7, 8 and 9 in Highchew Pleasant View Addition, North of Norway Dam at 5456 E. Highchew Court.

Violation: None

Request: He is requesting an 8’ height variance to build a pole barn.

President Jerry Thompson asked, and sir you are?

Dan Harvey stated, I’m Dan Harvey.

Director Weaver stated, I do have a new survey for you to look at, so please disregard the one on the back of the staff report.

President Jerry Thompson asked, while she is passing that out, Mr. Harvey do you have anything you would like to present?

Dan Harvey stated, no, this building is going to be 3’ taller than the one I had. I had a fire and it burned. This is going to be about 3’ taller than the old building. I think it had 12’ walls this one has 14’ walls for a big door.

President Jerry Thompson asked, what will this building be used for?

Dan Harvey stated, for a motor home. When I get another one.

President Jerry Thompson stated, you lost that one.

Dan Harvey stated, yes, it burned up in the fire. All of my toys and cars.

President Jerry Thompson asked, Diann do you have anything?

Director Weaver stated, the difference on the survey is that he has sold 10’ off of the South side to the adjoining property owner and the first survey did not reflect that.

Dan Harvey stated, that was kind of like a bribe.

President Jerry Thompson asked, so you agree with that?

Dan Harvey stated, yes, he needed that to build his house.

President Jerry Thompson stated, it is already under construction.

Director Weaver stated, yes, a permit was issued with a 17’ height so that he could get the floor in.

President Jerry Thompson stated, okay.

David Scott asked, what was that again?

Director Weaver stated, a perm it was issued for the building to be at a 17’ height, which would be in compliance with the ordinance so that he could get the floor in before the weather turned bad.

President Jerry Thompson asked, does anyone here care to address either for or against? Dave Stimmel any questions? Dave Scott, Gary Barbour and Carol Stradling any questions?

Without further discussion the board voted.

The Board finds the following:

1. That the property is properly zoned L-1, Lake District

2. That the lot was an existing lot of record at the time of enactment of the ordinance, as defined in Section 2.114.

3. That the site plan survey provided shows the lot size, existing improvements and proposed improvements, see file for exhibit.

4. That no objectors were present at the meeting.

5. That proper notice was given by mail to adjoining property owners.

6. That the request is for a an 8’ height variance to build a pole barn on Lots 7, 8 and 9 in Highchew Pleasant View Addition in Union Township, White County, Indiana.

COMMON DESCRIPTION: The property is located North of Norway Dam at 5456 E. Highchew Court.

7. That the variance herein authorized and granted is not so typical or recurrent in nature as to make typical or recurrent the formulation of a general regulation under an amendment of the ordinance for the above said condition or situation of the above said specific piece of property, and the Board additionally finds that the above said variance is based on the findings of fact so made that are required to be made under the provisions of Section 10.10 of the White County Zoning Ordinance, said findings of fact support and create a fact situation that authorizes the above said variance under the above said sections of the zoning ordinance.

The variance was granted based on the findings of fact by a vote of 5 affirmative and 0 negative.

****

#2382 Carol W. Smoot; The property is located on Lot 20 in Reynolds and Adkin’s Addition, in the City of Monticello at 116 E. Pierce Street.

Violation: None

Request: She is requesting a 27’ front (West) setback variance and a 7’ front (North) setback variance to build a shed. Also, a 10’ front (North) setback variance and a 5’ front (West) setback variance for a chain link fence (less than 4’ tall) to be put on the property.

President Jerry Thompson asked, ma’am you are?

Carol Smoot stated, I’m Carol Smoot.

President Jerry Thompson asked, would you like to add any more than what I have read?

Carol Smoot stated, not that I can think of.

President Jerry Thompson asked, Diann do you have anything?

Director Weaver stated, no.

President Jerry Thompson asked, does anyone here care to address this variance? Carol Stradling?

Carol Stradling stated, no.

President Jerry Thompson asked, Gary, Dave and Dave any questions?

David Stimmel asked, Diann does this bring the property into compliance?

Director Weaver stated, no it does not.

David Stimmel stated, it does not, there was no effort to do that.

Director Weaver stated, we did not do that, they were not doing anything to the home so we did not address the home at all. Yes we could have done that. We did not.

President Jerry Thompson asked, is there any other discussion?

Without further discussion the board voted.

The Board finds the following:

1. That the building site is properly zoned R-1, One Family Residential.

2. That the lot was an existing lot of record at the time of enactment of the ordinance, as defined in Section 2.114.


3. That the site plan survey provided shows the lot size, existing improvements and proposed improvements, see file for exhibit.


4. That no objectors were present at the meeting.

5. That proper notice was given by mail to adjoining property owners.


6. That the request is for a 27’ front (West) setback variance and a 7’ front (North) setback variance to build a shed. Also, a 10’ front (North) setback variance and a 5’ front (West) setback variance for a chain link fence (less than 4’ tall) to be put on Lot Number Twenty (20) in Reynolds and Adkin’s Addition to the City of Monticello, White County, Indiana.

COMMON DESCRIPTION: The property is located in the City of Monticello at 116 E. Pierce Street.


7. That the variances herein authorized and granted are not so typical or recurrent in

nature as to make reasonable practicable the formulation of a general regulation under an amendment of the ordinance for the above said specific piece of property, and the Board additionally finds that the above said variances are based on the findings of fact so made that are required to be made under the provisions of Section 10.10 of the White County Zoning Ordinance, said findings of fact support and create a fact situation that authorizes the above said variances under the above said sections of the zoning ordinance.

The variance was granted based on the findings of fact by a vote of 5 affirmative and 0 negative.

****

#2383 Daniel W. & Susan M. Boian, Owner; Perry McWilliams, Contractor, Applicant; The property is located on Lot Number 2 in Dolby Addition, South of Lowe’s Bridge at 3826 N. Dolby Court.

Violation: None
Request: They are requesting a Requesting a 4’ East side setback variance and a 13’ front setback variance to build an addition and add a second story with a deck and balcony.

President Jerry Thompson asked, sir you are?

Perry McWilliams stated, I’m Perry McWilliams.

President Jerry Thompson stated, okay you are the contractor.

Director Weaver stated, we also have a letter from the Boians stating that Perry will be representing them this evening.

Director Weaver stated, I do have a question before we go very far. At looking at the plans for the home I think we need to make a little clarification, it appears to me that the home is going to be removed except for the foundation.

Perry McWilliams stated, we are keeping all, it is a masonry construction right now. We are keeping all of the sidewalls. I’m not removing those.

Director Weaver stated, your plans do not state that, the plans state that the walls will be taken down to the foundation level.

Perry McWilliams stated, well I’m sorry if that is what I put on there, but we are actually going to keep the shell and adding on a little bit towards the water and then we are putting that deck balcony out facing the water. The masonry structure is salvageable, so I didn’t see a need in tearing it down. We are going to build inside of that in essence and then we will build up that other story. That is my fault if I put that down.

President Jerry Thompson stated, so with that we can still continue.

Director Weaver stated, the request is to you properly.

President Jerry Thompson stated, okay I thought so. Anything else sir?

Perry McWilliams stated, I don’t think so, we just want to improve the area. We want to build something that is attractive certainly for the area. We want to generate tax dollars and make things better for everyone. I know Dolby Court has been an interesting word around here in the last year. Last year I did a job for Lou Indovina down there. We did a two story room addition there.

President Jerry Thompson stated, okay please have a seat. Does anyone care to address the variance either for or against? Diann?

Director Weaver stated, we did receive a phone call today from the neighbor to the East of this property. She was not able to make it to the meeting this evening, but she did have some concerns about how far the balcony was going towards the lake.

President Jerry Thompson asked, do you care to address that sir?

Perry McWilliams stated, yes, sure. The balcony, it is an 8’ balcony okay, again this is something that you are going to be able to see through it. It is a railing structure with the post. It is just the traditional balcony. I think it is unfounded, I really do. I don’t think that what we are doing is going to effect either to the left or to the right either neighbor. Certainly the person who had called is further away than the other neighbor is. We are not, I know she is worried, but it is going to be okay. This will, she will not be angry with what we come up there, it is not going to affect the quality of her life at all.

President Jerry Thompson stated, okay.

Carol Stradling stated, there is a 7’ x 16’ addition. Is that masonry too?

Perry McWilliams stated, no that will be conventional wood frame.

Carol Stradling asked, will that be torn off?

Perry McWilliams asked, what be torn off?

Carol Stradling stated, this 7’ x 16.5’ bump out thing that is currently there.

Perry McWilliams stated, all that is there is a concrete slab.

David Stimmel stated, that is not what she is talking about.

Perry McWilliams stated, okay.

David Stimmel stated, she is talking about this piece that jets out back here 7’ x 16.5’.

Perry McWilliams stated, yes right, you are questioning it.

Carol Stradling stated, so you are going to keep those walls, are they masonry or wood frame.

Perry McWilliams stated, right now we are dealing with the structure itself and that is masonry, that is concrete block 8”.

Carol Stradling stated, okay. That just doesn’t look like concrete block to me.

David Scott stated, the 7’ x 16’ that sticks out the back that.

Perry McWilliams stated, well the front the lake going towards the lake if we are calling that the front.

David Scott stated, right, there is a 7’ x 16’ that goes out the back, I think the question is, is that going to stay or what, and it doesn’t appear to be masonry.

Perry McWilliams stated, no, at this point we are not sure, that doesn’t affect what we are asking for right now, we might tear that down, but right now we haven’t gotten that far on that structure. Good chance that it might be removed, but I don’t know exactly.

David Scott stated, if you put the second story on there will it go over it.

Perry McWilliams stated, no.

President Jerry Thompson asked, Dave Stimmel do you have anything?

David Stimmel stated, no.

President Jerry Thompson asked, Dave Scott anything?

David Scott asked, will the balcony come off the second story and then set on posts?

Perry McWilliams stated, that is correct, it will have a foundation underneath it.

David Scott asked, is he was to decide next year to enclose that does he have to come back through us to do that to do that?

Director Weaver stated, yes he would because of the variance.

David Scott stated, he would have to come back for a variance before he encloses that.

President Jerry Thompson asked, is there anything else Dave?

David Scott stated, no.

President Jerry Thompson asked, Gary? Carol anything?

Carol Stradling stated, the 13’ front we are looking at really would put it a little bit in front of the house to the West and looks like maybe 10’ in front of the house to the East. Does that sound right Diann?

Director Weaver stated, yes probably so.

Carol Stradling stated, at least with the balcony, the addition would be back even further from the front than the house to the West.

President Jerry Thompson stated, this really has nothing to do with this, but just out of curiosity are you a local contractor?

Perry McWilliams stated, yes.

President Jerry Thompson asked, is there anything else Carol?

Carol Stradling stated, no.

President Jerry Thompson any other discussion?

Director Weaver stated, with what Dave asked me, you could put a contingency on this that, that could not be enclosed if the board would choose to do that. You can put a contingency on the variance that the deck can not be enclosed.

David Scott stated, I don’t think it is necessary as long as they have to come back to include it. I think it would protect the neighbor’s concerns. That is the way I see it.

President Jerry Thompson asked, is everyone in agreement with that?

Carol Stradling stated, so Diann are you saying we don’t have to put the contingency on?

Director Weaver stated, no I’m saying you could put the contingency on it.

Carol Stradling stated, we could, but we don’t need to because they would have to come back.

Director Weaver stated, as long as the staff realizes that there was a variance. That is my concern, that the staff would catch that there was a variance on it.

David Scott stated, well maybe we should if you think they could miss it. Maybe we should put a condition on there that they couldn’t enclose it under the balcony.

Carol Stradling stated, without coming before the board again.

Director Weaver stated, the minutes get recorded down stairs so even if they don’t catch it is public record. I would hope that someone would catch it.

Perry McWilliams stated, it doesn’t matter to us, our full intention we are forthright with what we are doing here folks. That is going to be a deck, if you want to put that in the verbiage we are good with that. That doesn’t change our plans whatsoever.

Carol Stradling stated, it just protects people 10 or 20 years down the road.

Perry McWilliams stated, and I understand that. If the elderly woman was concerned with this, and all of sudden we built on and enclosed everything, that is not what you got approval for. That is fine.

David Scott stated, let's make that a condition.

President Jerry Thompson stated, that is a condition and a motion. Do we have a second?

Gary Barbour stated, I will second it.

President Jerry Thompson stated, all in favor signify by saying “aye” all opposed.

Motion on carried 5 to 0.

Without further discussion the board voted.

The Board finds the following:

1. That the property is properly zoned L-1, Lake District

2. That the lot was an existing lot of record at the time of enactment of the ordinance, as defined in Section 2.114.

3. That the site plan survey provided shows the lot size, existing improvements and proposed improvements, see file for exhibit.

4. That no objectors were present at the meeting.

5. That proper notice was given by mail to adjoining property owners.

6. That the request is for a Requesting a 4’ East side setback variance and a 13’ front setback variance to build an addition and add a second story with a deck and balcony on Lot Number 2 in Dolby Addition on Lake Shafer, Liberty Township, White County, Indiana.

COMMON DESCRIPTION: The property is located South of Lowe’s Bridge at 3826 N. Dolby Court.

7. That the variances herein authorized and granted are not so typical or recurrent in nature as to make reasonable practicable the formulation of a general regulation under an amendment of the ordinance for the above said specific piece of property, and the Board additionally finds that the above said variances are based on the findings of fact so made that are required to be made under the provisions of Section 10.10 of the White County Zoning Ordinance, said findings of fact support and create a fact situation that authorizes the above said variances under the above said sections of the zoning ordinance.

The variance was granted based on the findings of fact by a vote of 5 affirmative and 0 negative.

****

#2384 Tom F. Fee, Owner; Butch Moody, Applicant; The property is located on Part of Lots 11 & 12 in Bass Riffle Park, North of Lowe’s Bridge at 5162 E. Quiet Water Court.

Violation: None

Request: They are requesting a 6’ front setback variance, a 5’ East side setback variance and a 6’ West side setback variance to build an addition and to bring the existing house into compliance.

President Jerry Thompson asked, is there anyone here representing the Fee’s. There are no Fee’s. Diann let's go to you. You know Mr. Fee correct?


Director Weaver stated, no I don’t, I didn’t deal with him. Butch Moody filed this request.


President Jerry Thompson asked, and neither of them are present here tonight?


Director Weaver stated, no, Butch Moody is not here and I do not know the Fee’s.


President Jerry Thompson asked, you are here obvious for this. Now we can’t go very far this and to be safe with everyone. Due to the fact that there is a no show it looks like, what is your suggestion Diann, do we normally table it?


Director Weaver stated, normally that is what you have done in the past until they have representation.


David Scott stated, they can only table it once then?


Director Weaver stated, twice.


President Jerry Thompson asked, you have had no correspondence with them in the last couple of days or so?


Director Weaver stated, no, other than they did send us a revised application with their signatures on it, instead of Mr. Moody’s. I wasn’t aware that they were not going to be here and I’m not sure who was to represent this request.


President Jerry Thompson stated, I’m going to call on you, but you’ve got to understand that we are limited to what we can discuss here, but go ahead. I might cut you off.


James Crum stated, I’m James Crum and we live on lot 11 and we also live at 5162 East Quiet Water Court. I’m curious as to why my address is shown as requesting the variance both in the newspaper publication and the letter that I received. When on the back it indicates his address as 5149 Quiet Water Court. I was just curious about that.


Director Weaver stated, my guess would be that maybe there are some addressing problems up in your area. That is something that you need to come into the office and we can look at further there.


President Jerry Thompson asked, you address is sir?


James Crum stated, 5162.


President Jerry Thompson asked, your name is?


James Crum stated, James Crum. The other question I had is, is there any rezoning restrictions concerning the square footage of building that can go on a particular lot because this a rather small lot.


Director Weaver stated, no, not at this time there is not.


James Crum stated, other than that we do object to this because of the size of the building that he is proposing based on the size of the lot. Then the variance is, I don’t really agree with the drawing on the back.


President Jerry Thompson stated, okay I might have to have you draw a ling on that, we might be getting in a little deeper than we need to.


James Crum stated, fine.


President Jerry Thompson stated, without them being present. I’m not trying to be unfair to you. We will automatically set this up for the December meeting.


Director Weaver stated, yes, you can contact the office to verify that.


President Jerry Thompson asked, they will not get another mailing?


Director Weaver stated, no, not unless we find some kind of an error that needs to be corrected.


James Crum stated, there are a few to me.


President Jerry Thompson stated, our meeting is the 16th of December.


James Crum stated, fine.

President Jerry Thompson stated, okay we have some business to take care of.

Kathleen Lombardi asked, does this have anything to do with being uncooperative?

President Jerry Thompson asked, such as.

Kathleen Lombardi stated, him not being here. We are here and they are not here, this is kind of par for the course.

President Jerry Thompson stated, well we are not familiar with these people. I guess I can only answer you by saying that it is an Illinois address. Who knows why they are not here. This is not the first time that this has happened, no. We’ve heard and seen a lot of reason for no shows.

Kathleen Lombardi asked, is there a possibility that you can come out and look at this?

President Jerry Thompson stated, yes, that is a part of our job.

Director Weaver stated, I have been out to the property and I have provided the board with pictures.

President Jerry Thompson stated, we do have, that is Diann’s job. We have photos, but it is a part of our job for us to go out and take a personal visit. It is hard to all of the time, but we try. Like I said December 16 is the next meeting. It is the 3rd Thursday of the month, we always meet the 3rd Thursday of the month. How is next month stacking up?

Director Weaver stated, not to bad.

President Jerry Thompson stated, okay business. Okay what is that?

Director Weaver stated, I don’t know it could be them.

Discussion among the board while Diann goes down to open the door.

Director Weaver stated, the Fee’s are here, they have been trying to get in.

Tom Fee stated, we have been trying to get in and the door is locked. I came all the way from Chicago and it was storming.

President Jerry Thompson stated, okay have a seat, we have a couple of couples here.

Tom Fee stated, I’ve been trying for 10 minutes to get in.

Carol Stradling stated, the meeting started 1 hour 15 minutes ago.

Tom Fee stated, I’m on a different time. I’m sorry.

President Jerry Thompson stated, I’ve got to hold up to see if they are going to come back in the room. For the record, just a moment ago we tabled this until the December 16 meeting. In lieu of the fact, are you Mr. Fee?

Tom Fee stated, yes, I’m Tom Fee the owner.

President Jerry Thompson stated, due to the fact that they came from a distance and the time change and having difficulty getting into the courthouse this evening. We will address #2385 tonight.

(Jerry is re-reading the variance request for the Fees)

President Jerry Thompson stated, okay you are Mr. Fee.

Tom Fee stated, correct.

President Jerry Thompson asked, do you have anything else that you would like to add to the description and step up to the microphone if you would please?

Tom Fee stated, I’m Tom Fee the owner. It is just a small house and now that we have this new sewer going in. I have access now to build on the rest of my property that is now being used for septic. I want to put on a couple of bedrooms and a garage.

President Jerry Thompson asked, Diann do you have anything?

Director Weaver stated, no, not at this time.

President Jerry Thompson stated, I believe we have some concerns. Anyone here care to address the variance either for or against?

James Crum stated, I’m James Crum. As I stated before there is a mix up on the address on the variance and secondly we wouldn’t object to a smaller building, but the size of the building that he wants to put up is I think is much too big and is going to detract from the neighboring and adjoining properties. Not so much as us, but the other neighbor and I still think there is a discrepancy between the dimensions shown on the drawing itself.

President Jerry Thompson stated, okay Mr. Crum you are in what relationship to Mr. Fee property you are.

James Crum stated, lot 11 to the East.

Tom Fee stated, you have a fence down along there.

President Jerry Thompson stated, Mr. Fee you will get your turn. Does anyone on the board have any questions for Mr. Crum while he is at the microphone?

David Stimmel asked, is there anyone else here with you Mr. Crum? I know there was two couple back there.

James Crum stated, yes the other neighbors.

David Stimmel asked, is there someone here for lot 12 also.

James Crum stated, yes.

President Jerry Thompson asked, do you care to address the variance?

Jerry Lombardi stated, I’m Jerry Lombardi and I’m West I’m lot 12.

President Jerry Thompson stated, okay.

Jerry Lombardi stated, if he puts that big of a place on there on a 33’ lot, what is it going to do to us. I mean it is going to be right next to us. The way he likes to burn out there he is going to burn everybody out. Then it is going to be right over a gas line. He can’t do anything until they get the septic systems changed.

President Jerry Thompson asked, does anyone have any questions for this gentleman here?

Mr. Fee you can respond to this.

Tom Fee stated, the legal right is 8’ off of the line, I’m 5’. So we are only talking 3’ to be in compliance without a hearing. We are not talking very much. I’m 5’, we are supposed to be 8’. So we are only asking for a 3’ difference. The garage is not really that big of an addition. It is 30’ x 60’. I have absolutely no bedrooms or anything in the house right now. It is just one room. With a two car garage that is going to be 25’ deep. So really what are we saying the house is going to be 30’. 30’ x 30’. I don’t believe I’m asking for anything. I mean what it from the road up to the house I’m still 45’ off the back of the property. So when you pull you’ve got 45’. You pull into the driveway you come in to the garage. I’m storing the boat, I’m mean I’m on the lake and I want something to put the boat in. All I have there is one room, it is a very small house. There are absolutely no bedrooms. All I want to do is add on two bedrooms and a garage. My neighbor to the East of me, I could see the one neighbor, him and me had the same lot. The people who sold it split it. I’m so far away from him, there is a fence down the line I wouldn’t even be crossing the fence, so I don’t see how it could bother him at all. His house is 40’ away from me. There are trees, fence, and I’m staying 5’ off of that fence. This is like a dollar bill the lot is. It is 50’x 120’

President Jerry Thompson stated, Diann in our packets tonight you have included this.

Director Weaver stated, those are minutes from a pass variance that I thought the board might be interested in reading. Because of the simple fact just what was stated earlier, there is some kind of question about the size of the lots. In these old minutes it does state there is 3’ discrepancy. I’m not real sure what the situation is. I thought these might be interesting to the board to see what he had requested and asked.

Tom Fee stated, the architect found out that it was in my favor, the surveyor. The 3’ does belong to be, that was a question when we were putting the deck on in the front. The surveyor is right here in town Jim Milligan. He went with her surveyor and he did come to the conclusion that it was mine.

President Jerry Thompson stated, okay Carol.

Carol Stradling stated, so does that mean the survey we are looking at is correct.

Tom Fee stated, yes. We are still 5’ off the line with the house right now. I can’t spare too much because it is a small lot.

President Jerry Thompson stated, yes, we find that a lot along the lakes. Carol do you have anything else?

Carol Stradling stated, no not yet, some people like small houses on the lake they don’t want a lot of stuff, so that is what was there.

??? asked, we are entitled to build our home aren’t we.

Tom Fee stated, I’m paying for a sewer system, which on my land is being used by the septic system.

??? stated, we need a bedroom for our company and our kids. All the houses to the East are mansions.

Director Weaver stated, you are being assessed for 3 bedrooms. I have your property record card.

Tom Fee stated, there is one room. You walk in the front door that is it, there are no walls. The only wall there is separates the bathroom. When I bought the house it had an outhouse. It was just one room. When we were here before we built a deck on. We couldn’t go back any farther because of the building inspector. You have to have it. When they bring the sewer down, which they are doing now you can add on. We wanted to add on in the beginning when we went through the hearing for the deck and they said that you can not do that until the sewers are in. Now I’m back saying I want to add on. I can compromise if someone wants to say 28’ instead of 30’ or something I’m more than happy to do that on that to say that I can’t build.

Carol Stradling stated, I don’t think anyone has said that.

Tom Fee stated, isn’t 8’ and then I can build anything. I’m just trying to get a couple of feet.

David Scott stated, it is the total of sum.

Director Weaver stated, it is a total of 18’ and that is from the eaves.

Carol Stradling asked, is the septic in yet?

Tom Fee stated, yes, the sewer is not.

Carol Stradling asked, when will it be in?

Tom Fee stated, I don’t know. I’m not going to start anything until I got the paperwork. They are just around the street. Maybe by the spring.

Director Weaver stated, I know they are working on the East Side of the lake.

Tom Fee stated, I’m not going to start anything because I don’t want to mess up what I have now. I put a new septic and field in when I bought the house and totally remodel. New siding, new electric, new everything because it was just a shack.

Director Weaver stated, I did something different that I don’t normally do on the pictures this time. The Top right picture that you have I’m standing in front of his house looking out towards the street so you can get a view. I could not get a good picture from the street side up to the house. So I did a reverse angle so you can kind of see what he’s got and what he is going to be building at.

Carol Stradling stated, so his house is here, what is this building here.

Director Weaver stated, that the neighbors garage to the West.

Tom Fee stated, the bottom picture probably shows the best of what land I have. He has his garage right here next to me on the street. Where I would be stopping would be up past the garage with my garage and the house.

Director Weaver asked, the trailer that is in the pictures is that yours or the neighbors?

Tom Fee stated, the boat trailer is on my property. Really his house when they built it is to close to my property. Right now he is probably 3’, his house is really on top of my property instead of me being on top of his property.

Carol Stradling stated, not according to the survey. The survey says that he is 10’ from your property.

Tom Fee stated, okay, well then what does that put me to close to him then as far as saying I’m to close with this. I’m 5’ or 6’ away from the line.

President Jerry Thompson stated, yes your one point is.

Carol Stradling asked, Diann can you tell me what these yellow flags are for?

Director Weaver stated, no I can not I do not know.

??? stated, gas lines.

Carol Stradling stated, gas lines. One would be yours or his.

??? stated, I’m not sure if there is one because when they put this gas in they turned our gas complete off. I don’t know if there is one gas line going to two different homes, I don’t know, but hat is the gas line.

Carol Stradling stated, okay.

??? stated, that is pretty close to the line.

Tom Fee stated, even when you look up at the house that clump of bushes right there it goes in the middle.

President Jerry Thompson stated, okay. Gary Barbour what do you have for this anything?

David Scott, David Stimmel do you have anything?

David Stimmel stated, right now I have a tendency to deny the West Side setbacks and just do the front. That is the way that I’m kind of leaning. My feeling is that I want to deny the East and West setback variances because it would be actually less space then what currently exists between the property lines. If we just adhere to the required setbacks, it's still not going to be the same as the house to the house to the East and the West. From my way of looking at it, it allows him to build whatever he wants to builds there essentially within the codes, and still maintain the proper setbacks. I guess that was a comment that is what I’m really saying.

President Jerry Thompson stated, okay. Carol back to you.

Carol Stradling stated, the addition look awfully big for the lot. I guess I’m wondering about parking. How much could you cut it back?

Tom Fee stated, what do you mean 50’.

Carol Stradling stated, well with your angles, you are throwing out a lot of numbers. You’ve got to tell me where you are taking that from.

Tom Fee stated, the house right now, this picture right here at the bottom. The little house we want to add on to the back of the house.

Carol Stradling stated, I understand that.

Tom Fee stated, that is right 3’, 4’ or 5’ off of the property line. If what he is saying 8’, then the house would be one part here and then you are building another house here and coming back it wouldn’t look right. You want to add on to the house to the back of the house.

President Jerry Thompson stated, I don’t think that is what you are saying, is it.

David Stimmel stated, actually it was.

President Jerry Thompson stated, oh I’m sorry I thought you meant come in 8’ from both sides.

David Stimmel stated, no use the setbacks and Mr. Fee is correct in the sense that you would off set the house the proposed addition from the house.

President Jerry Thompson stated, oh all right.

Tom Fee stated, I image, well my neighbor is selling his house. That was another reason I wanted to get here to get an easement before we get a new neighbor in there. He is selling the house.

Carol Stradling stated, you are not getting an easement.

Tom Fee stated, I mean not an easement I mean variance. I mean I’ve got to have room for my boat. It is 21’ long I’ve got to have room to back it in.

President Jerry Thompson asked, would you be interested in listening to your neighbor's suggestions?

Tom Fee stated, sure.

President Jerry Thompson stated, the idea of this board is to help reach a workable solution.

Tom Fee stated, I’m for that.

President Jerry Thompson stated, all right so I’m asking your adjoining neighbors. Do you have a thought in mind that would be acceptable to you?

Jerry Lombardi stated, I mean okay where the boat trailer is. That there is just about right on the line and if he comes out there, he’s got a 47’ lot front and it is going down to 33’ in the back because theses are angles lots.

Tom Fee stated, it is 43’ not 33’

Carol Stradling stated, the survey says 33’.

Jerry Lombardi stated, if you taper that down what is he going to have right here right in between here. Yes he is going to be in from my garage where it is at. He is going to be small right in that 33’. It is going to be 36’ tapered down. My lawyer told me to tie on to the stake up by the front of his place and go down to the garage down where I’ve got 6’ where the garage is 2’ out into the road.

Tom Fee stated, I’m 40’ off the road.

Carol Stradling stated, you are 33’ off the road.

Tom Fee stated, yes 33’, that is parking right there. I don’t have a lot of cars. It is a summer home. When we retire we want to come down here and retire.

President Jerry Thompson stated, I understand.

Tom Fee stated, like I said the garage, I’m off the road. I like Jerry he is a good neighbor, he has helped me with my boat I like the guy. I mean I will work with you.

President Jerry Thompson stated, I hate postponing things. Would a little more time help or not? Would it help to come up with a workable solution? Are we in a position here where this proposed addition just will not work?

Jerry Lombardi stated, I think he will be building something to small, I mean in his lot there. Okay I don’t know how much it is going to taper down from 47’ to 33’ down there. It is going to be like what 2’ every 5’ or something.

President Jerry Thompson stated, probably.

Jerry Lombardi stated, okay then he is going to have 30’ right in there. How is going to get into his house up to the front or on the side. He is going to have nothing there.

David Scott stated, at the closest point he will have 5’ on one end and 4’ on the other end.

Tom Fee stated, that is a walkway or sidewalk. 5’ is a lot. I mean that is 36” wide. I mean where we are in Chicago house lots are 25, they are right on top of each other, and we have a walkway.

David Scott stated, I personally don’t like. I like for one side of the house or the other to have room to get something down and 5’ or 4’ is not much room. If you have a good size riding lawn mower you can’t even get it in the front yard without getting in your neighbor’s yard.

Tom Fee stated, that is true, but I don’t have much grass.

David Scott stated, anything I mean you can hardly get anything around in 5’ without. I don’t know how.

Tom Fee stated, the problem that we have with me and Jerry is he wants me to stay far way from him, but my other neighbor I’m no where near him and the fence and I’d like to stay where the house is how it was built on that line. Then if anything the house will line up coming back and take few feet whatever will make Jerry happy. I’ll just come back, if you want it shorter. I think the thing that bothers him, is that it is to close. It is not the length, it is the width.

Jerry Lombardi stated, and I know how he burns there, I mean.

Tom Fee stated, I knocked a tree down burned the limbs and stuff.

Jerry Lombardi stated, well it is still to close to my house, I mean I don’t like fires anyway.

Tom Fee stated, I think I’ve had one fire. It is not an issue with me.

Carol Stradling asked, would it be possible, because you are not going to build until the sewer system is in, to actually look at laying out this addition that you are going to put in. What kind of shape and size you need for the garage and how much room that will actually take to put your boat and car if that is what you want to put there. Then how are you going to use the other space for rooms? If you are going to have one big room...

Tom Fee stated, no two bedrooms.

Carol Stradling stated, lay that out and see how you are going to connect and it doesn’t sound to me that you are in a big hurry.

Tom Fee stated, no, I’m not.

Carol Stradling stated, I think, I would rather see some plans for this space instead of saying okay here take this space and build what you want inside that space. Let's use that get what you need to make the house comfortable.

Tom Fee stated, okay, that sounds good, I will do that for you. Do you see where the house is here, now if we come out pass that, there is the house. We want to get a view that would be a rec room or TV room where we will still see the lake. We still want to see the lake.

Carol Stradling stated, but you’ve got that where you are.

Jerry Lombardi stated, you’ve got the deck.

Carol Stradling stated, you’ve got the deck and you’ve got the house. I understand that you want to maximize that if you can, but you’ve put in your request for probably as wide as you can go. We can table it and you could design that space to be functional so you can get from room to room and the garage.

Tom Fee stated, the house is pretty small. What is it 24’ inside.

David Scott stated, it says 30’ x 16’.

Tom Fee stated, I mean it is small in there. So 16’ we wanted to come over so when we knock out the window at the back of the house and you come into the new addition we would put on a bathroom and two bedrooms and a family room.

Carol Stradling stated, okay see how that would fit and then come back. We can table this and you can see how that can fit. Maybe instead of making it 30’ across if you make it 26’ or whatever if that West wall would line up with your deck. You can have that parallel with that other property line. Just kind of plot that out and see how it fits and maybe we can come up with something that works for you and works for the neighbors and still keeps the neighborhood.

Tom Fee stated, I can pull away from his but I can’t do much with the guy next to me. Plus I’m on my property. The wall like I said I can get. I will cut back from swinging over by Jerry.

President Jerry Thompson asked, is that a possibility?

Jerry Lombardi stated, I would like to see how he is going to come back there, I mean to make rum.

President Jerry Thompson stated, I’m like Carol. I think you are going to have to lay it out with flags.

Jerry Lombardi stated, you can’t build over a gas line. You have to look at that situation.

Tom Fee stated, the gas line is down the line it is a new line. I’m 5’ away from it and I will not build over a gas line. They will not let you. I will call you Julie and they will come out there.

Carol Stradling stated, that is Holey Moley here. If you want to stake it out, put flags out, here is our garage can we get a car in here, can we make this work, this is where the bedroom is going to be, is this enough room for a bath, or maybe we can only do one big room, and if we have lots of company we put big bunk beds or something. I don’t know, but instead of just saying here is the space let's fill it. Figure out how that is going to lay out. You have the time.

Tom Fee stated, yes I have the time, this is not what I wanted to do, what if I want to go up.

Carol Stradling stated, you just need to figure out what you want.

President Jerry Thompson stated, you can go up.

Tom Fee stated, I know, but I wasn’t, but if we are going to pull it in, then.

David Stimmel stated, you will gain some square footage there.

Tom Fee stated, yes, that is what I’m looking to get. I’m looking at two things. I have three children, they always have friends, my son goes to Purdue, he is going to be a senior. Maybe we will go up instead of out.

Carol Stradling stated, sketch something out.

President Jerry Thompson stated, think it out and maybe we can come up with a common ground. It is hard from our end here and I hope you understand.

Tom Fee stated, yes I do.

President Jerry Thompson asked, do you want to put it on the December agenda.

Director Weaver stated, it is up to him.

Tom Fee stated, we can put it on the agenda and if I don’t get it down I can call and table it.

Carol Stradling stated, we have had to table two others, would January be better.

Tom Fee stated, January is fine, so the next meeting would be January.

Carol Stradling stated, we have a December meeting.

President Jerry Thompson stated, I don’t have it in front of me, but it is the 3rd Thursday of the month. So what ever the 3rd Thursday is that is when it will be.

Director Weaver stated, it would be January 20th.

David Scott stated, Diann can you see that these people get another letter.

Director Weaver stated, yes.

Tom Fee stated, thank you.

****

President Jerry Thompson stated, okay other business. White County Area Plan Commission vs. Kevin Reynolds. Diann do you want to discuss this.

Director Weaver stated, well I can tell you a little bit about it. I probably won’t go into detail like Jerry would. I don’t know if you remember this is where they were working on vehicles and tried to rezone and were denied and continued to work on the vehicles. We filed suit against them and they had indicated that they wanted to settle out of court and I think our settlement agreement was $5,000 fine and a restraining order that they could not do business on improperly zoned property. They are not agreeing to that and therefore this may end up in court. We will keep you up to date.

President Jerry Thompson asked, is there anything else pertaining to that?

Director Weaver stated, yes, The Rob Craig situation, I wanted to update you on it. If you remember the special exception for the double wide on his property, you gave him 90 days to get his inspection done, his title changed over. It has not been done. He came in and applied for the permit and the title was not in his name, he still does not have a septic permit, I’ve now denied the permit. He didn’t come back in to get any of this done, so I denied the permit and now have the second inspection in my office, he says he is working on getting the title in his name from Mr. Mike Triplett. That is a new name, I don’t know how that fits in, but supposable he is the new owner of the mobile home. I can’t explain it, I don’t understand it. I have turned this over to Jerry to take care of it. Is that what the board wishes to do?

David Stimmel stated, yes.

Director Weaver stated, I have sent him a letter stating he must remove the home. Based on the conditions that the board put on his special exception it is invalid. He did not abide by your requirements, so I denied the permit and told him he had to remove the home. He is now trying to get the title and all of this. If the board wishes to proceed I will tell Jerry that.

President Jerry Thompson stated, I think that is agreeable with everyone. Is there anything else?

Director Weaver stated, we had a variance last month I just wanted to give you a heads up on this. I’m going to send a letter out to the surveyor, I don’t know if you recognize the name Spass, it was here last month. He was doing an addition on an existing building, well his house, his construction got shut down by the building inspector this week. He has a main electric line running through his lot and he is building a two-story addition and if I remember right his roof is only 18” from this power line. There were no easements, no power lines shown on the survey to where this board would have known that. Even when I went out to the property I didn’t notice it. I’m thinking we need to send out a letter to the surveyor telling them we want this on there, to show these overhead lines and what they are and that type of thing. There is a granted easement across this man’s property for this power line, it was not shown on the survey. I just wanted to up date you on that. It is not our error.

David Scott asked, the electric line is it for his property or is it a main?

Director Weaver stated, it is a main, I think for than just a neighbor. Last I have, we are working on our 2005 schedule and I noticed when I was working on this that our meeting date in July falls the last day of the county fair and I know what kind of conflict that causes. I wanted to ask the board what you wanted to do.

Carol Stradling stated, how about the week before, let's do it the week before.

Director Weaver stated, is that what you want to do.

President Jerry Thompson stated, the week after. Is there anything else?

Director Weaver stated, I don’t think so.

President Jerry Thompson stated, Dave Stimmel went to this was a one-day deal. Dave went to a seminar.

David Stimmel stated, it was called the Nitty Gritty Work of Land Use Planning. I think Diann send everyone a flier. I just sent them a check and showed up. It was well worth the time and effort. There were two people there doing the presentation and there were 15 to 20 people from Vigo County and surrounding counties around the general area. Lawyers, but it was a real relax group and they put on a presentation and spent 6 full hours there. The provided lunch and things like that, it was extraordinary interesting. They talked about the defendable positions and decisions. They spent a lot of time talking about BZA’s. I just thought it was going to be Area Plan stuff, but they spent a lot of time talking about BZA. I told Gary and you can have the girls delete this, but the guy who was the head cheese doing all of this was the brother in law of the gal who was the primary in the Indiana Beach suit on the roller coaster suit. When I told him where I was in White County, he said oh yeah. We had a nice chat about that.

David Scott asked, did you find out anything that we are doing right or wrong?

David Stimmel stated, well I’ll be honest with you I put that in my truck and I haven’t looked at it sense. I did take several pages of notes, there was a lot of stuff in there. I told Jerry, I really regret not trying to get someone to go with me. Usually what happens if we could have talked afterwards with somebody instead of my thoughts we probably would have got a lot out of it. I would go again to be quite frank.

Director Weaver stated, let me know, I just wont travel alone.

David Stimmel stated, yes.

Carol Stradling stated, I went to one several years ago and I got a lot out of it.

David Stimmel stated, I would like to go with a few people, I think it would be cool to go and be able to talk about things afterwards and during. There is a lot of value to it.

Director Weaver stated, we do have in our budget to reimburse you if you would go to these type meetings.

David Stimmel stated, the thing that was interesting was this was put on by the Extension Service. This came from Greg Bossaer office that is where we got the fliers.

President Jerry Thompson stated, I think it is great you took the time and effort to go.

Director Weaver stated, I wanted to give you an update, I got an update on the consulting firm that is doing our new ordinance. They have contracted with HNTB, which is the woman who did the presentation. There is going to be an organizational meeting sometime in December. She has suggested that we appoint a committee of up to 35 people, which I think is a lot. There is going to be a committee that this is going to work through. I’m not being kept informed very well. I don’t have a lot of detail. I’ve tried to attend to Commissioners meetings when I knew they were going to discuss this, I can’t get out of the office. Every time I’ve gotten out I have missed it.


David Stimmel stated, in addition to that they spend a lot of time talking in the 6-hour period about when you rewrite your zoning laws of what to do and things to look out for. All I could think of wishing we could talk again before we actually got this rewrite out of the way so we could have some suggestion. Maybe some people from the APC just not the BZA.


Carol Stradling asked, how often do they do these classes.


David Stimmel stated, there will be more in the spring, I specifically asked. I don’t know if it will be in the February, March, or April.


Carol Stradling stated, I would think that now is the time to really look at that and since we are rewriting it. I don’t know what changes were in the last rewrite. We have come across some real weaknesses.


Director Weaver stated, we are right now with the APC discussing new definitions for a front yard, revising our definition for a front yard. Stating a corner lot does have two front yards. That is how we have always treated it, and in the old ordinance it does that that.


David Stimmel asked, what happen to.


Director Weaver stated, I don’t know, they left.


President Jerry Thompson stated, I didn’t get it.


David Scott asked, what was it.


David Stimmel stated, he was the gentleman that tried to speak the last time.


Director Weaver stated, was that the same.


The meeting adjourned.

Respectfully submitted,

Gary Barbour, Secretary

Diann Weaver, Director

White County Area Plan Commission