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February 7, 2011



The White County Drainage Board convened at 10:30 A. M. in the Commissioners’ Room of the White County Building, Monticello, Indiana. Board members present were: President Ronald Schmierer, Vice President Steve Burton, and Drainage Board Member John Heimlich. Also present were Attorney George W. Loy, Surveyor Bradley Ward and Drainage Assistant Mary Sterrett.
Also in attendance were:
Sharon Watson-White County Soil and Water
Robert Thomas-Town of Wolcott
Chad Reynolds-Town of Wolcott
The first item on the agenda was to approve the minutes from the January 17th, 2011 meeting. Board Member Heimlich so moved. Board Member Burton seconded the motion. Motion carried unanimously.
The next item on the agenda was discuss potential projects on Kleyla Ditch, Chamberlain Lateral Branch of the Dorsey Ditch and Crowell-Wells Drain.
Surveyor Ward stated, "The Kleyla Ditch it is there where it goes north out of Reynolds. Joe Bilyeu has asked about having that cleaned. So, it probably will have to be petitioned since it is going from US 24 all the way out. Pretty big operation as such, just kind of a heads up on that."
Board Member Heimlich replied, "Wait a minute, that is from ……"
Surveyor Ward answered, "US 24 going out to the Fraser Ditch."
Board Member Heimlich replied, "North, ok! Part of that is tile so you really wouldn’t start at…."
Surveyor Ward replied, "I thought most of that was open! Maybe from High School Street?"
Board Member Heimlich replied, "It was filled in from US 24 to the next block then it becomes open again."
Surveyor Ward stated, "I think that is what he was talking about. There where they are wanting to out let basically."
Chairman Schmierer stated, "Ask them to bring a petition to you!"
Board Member Heimlich replied, "Are they going to do anything with that.…there is some kind of structure in there where that was filled in between US 24, just right north of ……."
Chairman Schmierer asked, "The north right there by Wiese’s Trailer Court, they filled that in didn’t they, put a tile in there?"
Board Member Heimlich replied, "There is some kind of structure of some kind that is why I wondered if that was part of it or if it is just the open ditch."
Surveyor Ward answered, "I think mostly he was concerned about where they are going to bring that new storm sewer in at the bend."
Chairman Schmierer asked, "Doesn’t that go down through Isoms and down through there… in back of Isoms…….the Kleyla?"
Board Member Heimlich replied, "Yeah, Yeah, then comes across and goes by the elevator."
Chairman Schmierer said, "I thought down there at Isoms I thought they cleaned that out back in there one time."
Board Member Heimlich answered, "Yes, they have but he is talking about the north part."
Surveyor Ward replied, "Denny (retired Surveyor) said, looking at the drainage map, it starts down here and that this part has already been cleaned but I don’t know exactly when."
Board Member Heimlich stated, "Yeah, it has probably been five (5) or six (6) years!"
Surveyor Ward continued, "They are bringing that new storm sewer in and I think he was mostly concerned about this stretch right in here. That new storm sewer is going to dump in here right at the bend." Still looking at the map the Board Member were still discussing the location of the project.
Surveyor Ward continued, "I have not been out there to look at it yet, he stopped in Wednesday or Thursday of last week. Just a heads up on that I guess, I told him that it would have to be petitioned but I would double check here first."
Surveyor Ward stated, "The Chamberlain, part of the Dorsey Ditch, they are kind of the same situation. The Crowell-Wells is a water way over by Idaville."
Chairman Schmierer replied, "I know where the Crowell-Wells is at."
Board Member Heimlich asked, "The one over by the school?"
Chairman Schmierer continued, "Down south of the school…the air pilot had that."
Surveyor Ward said, "Mr. Potts was in and wanting to get that cleaned up. There are some water holes in there and some willows growing up in it."
Chairman Schmierer replied, "If we work on that you will have to get with Carroll County because a lot of that is in Carroll County."
Surveyor Ward replied, "It is the part that is all in White County, a thousand (1000) foot stretch that is in White County. It drains in to Carroll County."
Chairman Schmierer stated, "Don’t they pay in to it in Carroll County? So, if we are going to use Maintenance Money we got to go to work and notify Carroll County. Right!"
Surveyor Ward replied, "Right! Then the one on the Dorsey Ditch (Chamberlain Branch) there is a stretch here that Kenny Altman…. Drainage Board looking at map, there is about a thousand (1000) foot stretch right here that drains in to the Dorsey Ditch. There is a lot of grass and stuff growing up in there. Three (3) tiles drain in to it right here at the corner of that forty (40). He is wanting to get that cleaned up."
Chairman Schmierer asked, " Is there any money in that ditch?"
Surveyor Ward replied, "Well, it is paid by the Dorsey and there is seventy thousand dollars ($70,000.00) in the account. Randy DeVault gave me an estimate of about eighteen hundred dollars ($1,800.00) to clean that stretch out."
Board Members still viewing the map as to the location of the problem on the Chamberlain Branch of the Dorsey. Board Member Burton said, "Right down here is were they…if you remember a year or so ago when they putting those turbines in they put a…Kelly, Deckards and them, kind of did that in a hurry so that’s……I kind of surprised that he is wanting to do it instead of Browns."
Surveyor Ward replied, "It was Kenny Altman that stopped in."
Chairman Schmierer said, "We need to get quotes on it, you will have to put it out for quotes."
Surveyor Ward stated, "The Crowell-Wells, Jim Simons gave me a fifteen hundred dollar ($1,500.00) estimate on that. Have to get Carroll County first?"
Chairman Schmierer replied, "Yes, you will have to notify them and you will also have to put it out for quotes. Three quotes!"
Surveyor Ward said, "That is all I had!"
Chairman Schmierer asked Board Member Heimlich to fill the Town of Wolcott representatives in as to what was discussed with Marsha Mackey, Wolcott Town Council President.
Board Member Heimlich asked, "Did you talk to Marsha?"
Robert Thomas replied, "Before she talked to you! Linda called us this morning and made us aware that there was not going to be any Board Members at this meeting and she thought the Engineers would be here."
Chairman Schmierer replied, "They are not here either!"
Robert Thomas continued, "Chad and I, we don’t know a lot about what letter got sent out, what letter got sent back or…."
Chairman Schmierer asked, "Have you seen the letter?"
Board Member Heimlich stated, "So, you have not seen any of this? Well, I stopped in one day late last week and got copies of this. Most of it is e-mails between Todd (Frauhiger) and Marc Rape (Stand and Associates), back and forth with Todd. Princeton Township Board had sent a letter but it really wasn’t what we were needing. I think that is what Todd (Frauhiger) indicated to Marc (Strand &
Associates). That is what I indicated to Marsha (Mackey) what we really need is an easement from the Township that indicates that the park is in affect be the retention pond. She says that they have talked to the Township Board Members and that they are aware and that they are fine with everything that is going on. It should not be a problem if George (Attorney Loy) drafts the language that is needed. But the letter that we got from them really doesn’t indicate that they understand what they are being called on to do."
Robert Thomas replied, "Right! So, you are willing to have George (Attorney Loy) write up what….."
(Attorney George Loy was in Court and was not present at this meeting at this time.)
Board Member Heimlich stated, "I think George (Attorney Loy) will be down here and that is what I want to discuss with him. What language we really need basically it is an easement."
Chairman Schmierer replied, "An easement that is what they need. They done that up here in the north end of town with the church and such. When they were here the last time did they get a copy of that?"
Surveyor Ward stated, "They got a copy of that!"
Robert Thomas answered, "They did get a copy of that! Marc (Rape) got a copy of it and took it back to the town."
Chairman Schmierer replied, "Well, the letter we got is definitely not an easement. We definitely need an easement."
Robert Thomas said, "No! This isn’t right, this is pretty typified here."
Board Member Heimlich stated, "I tried to explain that to Marsha (Mackey) I think she got a little up set with me but we have to administer the Drainage Ordinance and to do that we have got to have an easement."
Chad Reynolds replied, "I think they were under the understanding that they needed a letter that things were ok and things could roll then."
Robert Thomas replied, "I never read that but I’m sure that it spelled out every thing on there that needed to be done."
Chad Reynolds replied, "May be if Marc (Rape) had a copy and apparently may be he didn’t get it handed over to the right people of the town. I never seen any thing that came from the Board."
(At this point in the meeting the Drainage Board was still waiting for Attorney Loy.)
Drainage Assistant Mary Sterrett gave the members of the Drainage Board a list of the ditches to be assessed for 2011 and all members signed this document. The document shall be turned into the White County Auditor on this date.
Board Member Heimlich stated, "I guess the other thing I had was a question for George (Attorney Loy) probably too. Well, he was gone last week so you probably haven’t heard any more on the Wayne Hunt issue. I don’t know if George (Attorney) has heard from his Attorney or not:"
Surveyor Ward said, "We are still waiting on the letter from Cass County (waiving their rights) on the Mertz-Muck project."
Board Member Heimlich reported on the Indian Creek Project to the other members of the White County Drainage Board. He stated, "The Engineer has proposed to him which I think is a good idea, is dividing that project up for the assessments. So, that one stretch that goes way up into Fulton County that would be assessed a different rate than the one that goes through White County and then over into Cass. They would be paying a smaller assessment because they wouldn’t be paying for all that work up north and on into Fulton County. There would be work done in White County where the brush would be taken off one side and I think there would be some dipping in a couple of places. So, we will wait to see if they get a remonstrance. There will be a hearing on that probably sometime this spring or summer."
Chairman Schmierer replied, "That has been going on for five (5) years or longer."
Broad Member Heimlich said, "The Judge over in Cass County threw it out. So, now we are in Pulaski County, we will see what happens. Personally the assessments are more along the lines what I thought they should have been in the first place. I think they addressed the concerns of those people in Cass County had over by Royal Center. They may still object that they are paying any thing at all but we will see."
Chairman Schmierer stated, "I don’t see why we can’t go to work and asked George (Attorney Loy) to write that letter. Do you want to wait on George (Attorney Loy)?"
Board Member Heimlich replied, "Well, I don’t know. I thought he might have….I don’t know how long he is going to be. He said he would be back down."
Board Member Heimlich went up to the Courts to check on Attorney Loy. He returned and said that George (Attorney Loy) would like for us to wait. Attorney Loy said to give him ten (10) minutes.
(Attorney Loy is now present at the Drainage Board Meeting.)
Chairman Schmierer asked Attorney Loy if he had seen the paper work and e-mails regarding the Princeton Township letter.
Attorney Loy answered, "No, heard about it! To my understanding it is not sufficient."
Chairman Schmierer replied, "Well, this is what you got and I said that is not an easement for what we need from the park. We suggested that…..can you prepare an easement for them or tell them what they need?"
Attorney Loy replied, "Sure! Well, I gave some body a sample of what we did over at the….it is the garden variety…this isn’t ….."
Robert Thomas stated, "You gave our Engineer a sample of what was done at the church."
Chairman Schmierer replied, "That is what we told them, we would wait and ask you! Do you want to draw or use the copy that we gave them?"
Board Member Heimlich stated, "Marsha Mackey had called me between our meetings here and I explained that really this letter didn’t really address what……"
Attorney Loy replied, "Yeah, I would be happy to assist! Sure! I’m going to need to talk to…. ….part of it requires some input from Todd Frauhiger our Engineer. I can put it in to easement form, Yeah!"
Robert Thomas stated, "It might help us because you sent that sample with Marc (Rape) our Engineer and I know that he stopped at Linda’s (Bajzatt) office that day. But when it got handed to Linda (Bajzatt) and then none of the Board members want to come to the meetings."
Attorney Loy replied, "Yeah, when this all started they didn’t have a Township Trustee or even a full Board now I guess we do. Well, Princeton does!"
Chairman Schmierer said, "Linda’s (Bajzatt) husband is the Township Trustee."
Chad Reynolds replied, "Tom Bajzatt is the Trustee."
Board Member Heimlich asked, "The Wayne Hunt thing…did you hear back from his Attorney?"
Attorney Loy replied, "Well,…… I gave you copies of the letter that I received and I guess I need to tell them when you propose to listen to their……"
Board Member Heimlich said, "You had a call in to him, have you heard back from him?"
Attorney Loy replied, "I have been gone I just got back this morning. So, I have not checked my phone messages. Jocelyn did not tell me that he called, I will let you know."
Chairman Schmierer said, "Well, that is nothing pressing!"
Attorney Loy replied, "I wouldn’t have any problem with you saying "NO" again, never mind, there is nothing to resolve!"
Steve Burton replied, "I’m sure their offer is to our benefit."
Attorney Loy stated, "Every lawyer thinks their offer is….No, the ball is in their court."
Board Member Heimlich replied, "The problem is when some body goes ahead on their own the only way they can do that is ok, you are going to collect from the landowners and do it on your own."
Attorney Loy stated, "Or make advance arrangements through the Surveyor’s Office and the Commissioners to….."
Board Member Heimlich replied, "But in short of that if we go a head and start ..…"
Attorney Loy responded, "You would have a flood of people."
Chairman Schmierer stated, "If you paid him one (1) you would have ten (10) of them."
Attorney Loy replied, "I will keep you posted on what I hear, how about that?"
Robert Thomas asked, "Do we just let our Board know that you are going to draft some thing up or……"
Speaking to Surveyor Ward, Attorney Loy asked, "Can you get a hold of Todd (Frauhiger) and ask him to call me about this. With the intent of putting together an easement in the same form that we have done others, including this one. Just this one I use is an example."
Surveyor Ward replied, "Yes!"
Chad Reynolds asked, "We have got a copy of that, is that sufficient if they just put the verbiage in to our….."
Attorney Loy stated, "No! Well, practicing law is a little more difficult than that, a little more involved."
Chad Reynolds replied, "They need to get with you then at some point?"
Attorney Loy answered, "Yes!"
Chad Reynolds replied, "We will let them know!"
Attorney Loy stated, "That is something that they will need to pass at a meeting since this is a municipal entity. It is a Township, they will have to pass a resolution at a Board meeting to do it properly and then actually sign the easement. This puts the ball on them it doesn’t say that..…again I keep saying the last entity who touches it is the one that you know gets the blame. We just don’t want to sign off on some thing …."
Robert Thomas replied, "We understand that!"
Attorney Loy replied, "So, this puts it on the Township’s shoulders and says "yeah" that is fine with us."
Robert Thomas stated, "Right away, then if it does….."
Attorney Loy replied, "Then it is their deal!"
Robert Thomas thanked the Drainage Board and Chairman Schmierer adjourned the meeting.