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April 4, 2011
The White County Drainage Board convened at 10:30 A. M. in the Commissioners’ Room of the White County Building, Monticello, Indiana. Board members present were: President Ronald Schmierer, Vice President Steve Burton, and Drainage Board Member John Heimlich. Also present were Attorney George W. Loy, Surveyor Bradley Ward and Drainage Assistant Mary Sterrett.
Also in attendance were:
Sharon Watson-White County Soil and Water Attorney Rebecca Trent
Doug Barnard-Chalmers Town Council David Rosenbarger
Jared Rosenbarger Dirk Fleck
Engineer Ken Smith – Municipal Civil Corporation
The first item on the agenda was to approve the minutes from the March 21st, 2011 White County Drainage Board meeting. Board Member Steve Burton so moved. Board Member John Heimlich seconded the motion. Motion carried unanimously.
Next on the agenda was to award the 2011 Spray Contract.
Chairman Schmierer asked, "Brad (Surveyor Ward) what did you find out on our spraying contracts?"
Surveyor Ward replied, "Here is the equipment that they use, the one that was in question, the new one - Right of Way Management and the chemical he uses. They have sprayed for Jasper County in the past."
Chairman Schmierer asked, "Has Jasper County been satisfied or do you know?"
Surveyor Ward replied, "Satisfied, they got there a little bit late, later than they wanted."
Board Member Burton asked, "Did our contract have a time when …?"
Surveyor Ward replied, "July 1st, I think is what we put on the contract."
Drainage Assistant Sterrett replied, "So far no body has ever hit that date."
Chairman Schmierer said, "No, it is always after that! They have got decent equipment."
Surveyor Ward replied, "Basically they said, they were no better or no worse than any body else."
Chairman Schmierer asked, "Is that what Jasper County told you?"
Board Member Burton replied, "At least they are honest."
Chairman Schmierer said, "Well, they have done some work around then. They bid well enough we can probably try it once."
Board Member Burton remarked, "They could do it twice at that cost!"
Surveyor Ward asked, "Do you want the numbers again?"
Chairman Schmierer replied, "They are Right of Way Management they are low bid at Twenty Seven Thousand, Four Hundred and Twenty-four dollars ($27,424.00)."
Board Member Heimlich made a motion to approve Right of Way Management Company for the 2011 Spraying Projects. Board Member Burton seconded the motion. Motion was carried unanimously.
Attorney Loy stated, "That was that really low bid!"
Board Member Heimlich replied, "There were two (2) low."
Attorney Loy asked, "You ran the numbers and found every thing correct?"
Surveyor Ward replied, "Yeah!"
Chairman Schmierer said, "There was Twenty Thousand Dollars ($20,000.00) difference between high bid and low bid?"
Attorney Loy replied, "There were two (2) high and two (2) low."
Chairman Schmierer replied, "Forty-three thousand (43,000) seven hundred (700) verses Twenty-seven thousand (27,000) four hundred (400). All right, that is out of the way."
Board Member Heimlich asked, "Back to the minutes, did we get every thing clear up with Wolcott? Was every thing signed?"
Surveyor Ward replied, "They have not turned in their easement."
Board Member Heimlich answered, "It has not!"
Surveyor Ward continued, "They have not attempted to pick up their Drainage Permit either."
Chairman Schmierer replied, "I thought that was such a rush."
Board Member Burton remarked, "The ball is in their court!"
Attorney Loy replied, "Well, we have done our job."
Chairman Schmierer remarked, "We have done every thing we were supposed to do!"
Next on the agenda Town of Chalmers Storm Water Revised Drainage Review
Chairman Schmierer stated, "On this we got an e-mail from Todd Frauhiger (Engineer). (E-mail dated Thursday, March 31, 2011 10:28 AM) Chairman Schmierer read the e-mail. I have reviewed the Chalmers plans, and I recommend approval of the re-submittal. I’ll call you shortly. Todd (copy attached to file copy of these minutes)."
Chairman Schmierer continued, "I just got off the phone with him. It is my understanding of this plan that you are dropping the water in to a man hole. How far back are you from the ditch?"
Engineer Ken Smith replied, "We are thirty-five (35) feet from where the water comes in to the man hole. To where it is on loaded in to the ditch we are thirty-five (35) feet back from the flow line."
Chairman Schmierer asked, "So, it is going to gravity feed in to the ditch?"
Engineer Ken Smith continued, "Then there is a rip rap section about five (5) to eight (8) feet from where it enters. So, it comes down hits the man hole down five (5) feet, flows through the pipe and hits the rip rap section. There is an other five (5) foot of rip rap before it gets to the ditch. So, about forty (40) feet fall before it actually gets to the ditch."
Chairman Schmierer asked, "So, there will not be any pressure on it?"
Engineer Ken Smith answered, "No, it is actually lower this way than what it was before."
Chairman Schmierer replied, "When you put the pipes straight in there would be pressure on it before if you pumped it in pressure wise."
Engineer Ken Smith replied, "……….. this version verses more than three (3) feet the last version."
Chairman Schmierer continued, "I thought you were going to pressurize it right in to the ditch."
Engineer Ken Smith replied, "DNR would not allow it!"
Chairman Schmierer remarked, "DNR would not allow it! Well, I just wanted to make sure we were not doing that. Is there any thing else that you want to bring to our attention on this plan that change in it or not?"
Doug Barnard asked, "We had just submitted a Two Thousand Dollar ($2,000.00) review fee to change that, is that still necessary?"
Chairman Schmierer replied, "Yeah, he will spend it. We don’t review them he has to review them for us. He has been working on it."
Doug Barnard replied, "I guess my only question would be, the flow in to the ditch we did not change any thing."
Chairman Schmierer said, "Well, if he doesn’t use it he will give it back to you. You did change the plan though; you absolutely did change the plan. You were gravity feed before and now you are forced feeding down doing it the way you done it."
Doug Barnard continued, "The bid package had that as an alternate and I guess when it was submitted as plans for the permit it did not show that alternate."
Chairman Schmierer replied, "No! We did not see it! It was not on there that I know of."
Doug Barnard replied, "That is our fault!"
Chairman Schmierer asked, "Is there any thing else that you have a question on?"
Board Member Heimlich stated, "Mary (Drainage Assistant Sterrett) said they need the permit too, they have did not pick up or paid for their permit."
Chairman Schmierer asked, "They did not pay for their permit?"

Drainage Assistant Sterrett replied, "They have not gotten one yet!"
Chairman Schmierer replied, "You have not got a permit yet!"
"Engineer Ken Smith stated, "…we will do it right after the meeting."
Surveyor Ward said, "It is an other Thirty-five Dollars ($35.00) for the permit."
Drainage Assistant Sterrett replied, "Which we do not take out of your Two Thousand Dollars ($2,000.00)."
Chairman Schmierer asked, "Are there any other questions on it? Dave (Rosenbarger) do you have any questions on it since it goes across your ground?"
Dave Rosenbarger replied, "No, I don’t!"
The motion was made by Board Member Burton to approved the Revised Storm Water Plan of the Town of Chalmers. Board Member Heimlich seconded the motion. The motion carried unanimously.
Chairman Schmierer signed the Revised Storm Water Plan for the Town of Chalmers.
Doug Barnard of the Town of Chalmers said, "Thanks Gentlemen!"
Next on the agenda was to discuss Maintenance Projects on the McKillip Branch #1 Drain #568,
E. C. Blanchard Drain # 663 and Walter Chapman Drain #696
Surveyor Ward showing computer generated pictures said, "The McKillip is this branch here, the Little Monon drains in to the Main McKillip, I guess. Todd Redlin was in! This stretch here the south basically half mile had been cleaned five (5) years ago but the outlet stretch is still pretty bad. He was wanting to know if that could be dipped."
Chairman Schmierer replied, "The only problem you have with that is, if you go back and check in the minutes on that. I think we might have cleaned as far as we can because that goes in to a natural water the Little Monon is a natural water thing. I am not sure we can clean any further."
Surveyor Ward replied, "That would be natural water, I will look!"
Chairman Schmierer continued, "We will need to know that, remember John (Board Member Heimlich) we had that discussion with Rick (Raderstorf)."
Surveyor Ward continued, "May be that is why he came in."
Chairman Schmierer continued, "That what we got in some of these other drains. Is that what he wanted cleaned?"
Surveyor Ward replied, "Yeah!"
Chairman Schmierer continued, "That is not part of the natural water way but I have seen a lot worse than that."
Attorney Loy replied, "The question is, is it part of our drain?"
Chairman Schmierer replied, "Well yeah, because see it goes in to the Little Monon and we can’t work there so close to it same way as the lake out there. That is reason why I want to make sure what we are doing Brad (Surveyor Ward) to see where we were at."
Surveyor Ward continued, "Here is an aerial of it! This is the McKillip that runs into Monon eventually. Basically right here, this part right here was dipped. If that is the reason then no obviously."
Chairman Schmierer stated, "Let’s make sure on the minutes on that."
Surveyor Ward continued, "Ok, then his other two (2) would have to be petitioned, just letting you guys know we are going to petition those two (2)."
Chairman Schmierer asked, "Where are they located now?"
Surveyor Ward replied, "They are in Monon Township. Looking at computer generated maps Surveyor Ward said, "This is Lee, one of them kind of wraps around this way and the other ones is up here. Waiting on the aerial to pop up. The Blanchard Drain and the Water Chapman."
Board Member Burton asked, "Do they have their own water shed or are they shared?"
Chairman Schmierer asked, "Are they both on their own maintenance?"
Drainage Assistant Sterrett replied, "They are both shared with Jasper County."
Surveyor Ward replied "Shared with Jasper County."
Board Member Burton asked, "What is the name of that big ditch?"
Drainage Assistant Sterrett replied, "The Owen-Denton?"
Chairman Schmierer asked, "Are they on with that?"
Drainage Assistant Sterrett answered, "No, they are on by their selves."
Chairman Schmierer replied, "They are on by their selves but they are shared with Jasper County? Is there money in them or do you know?"
Surveyor Ward replied, "There is, there is some to start with. I could not tell you the numbers off the top of my head."
Chairman Schmierer replied, "Ok, who was petitioning them?"
Surveyor Ward answered, "Todd Redlin, I don’t know if it is his ground or if he is just managing the farm."
Board Member Heimlich replied, "I think he farms it, he was in here before."
Chairman Schmierer stated, "We done some work when we did that one off Sixteen (16) north there, he was in on that."
Surveyor Ward continued, "There was one I think he said it was dipped about twelve (12) years ago. It was one (1) of the two (2) projects."
Chairman Schmierer said, "Well, let’s get them petitioned them."
Surveyor Ward replied, "Ok!"
Chairman Schmierer asked, "What else to you have for us?"
Surveyor Ward answered, "Got the Kellenburger!"
Dirk Fleck stepped to microphone and he said, "This thing has been on the list now for twenty (20) some years!"
Drainage Assistant Sterrett replied, "About eight (8) years!"
Dirk Fleck continued, "It is more than eight (8) years. We started with that last Surveyor what ever his name was; he kept putting me off the whole time. He promised me that Mr. Ward would get on it right a way."
Chairman Schmierer said, "He might have lied to you too!"
Dirk Fleck said, "I am beginning to catch on to that! We slated it for Reconstruction and we would like propose to that it be switched to Maintenance and probably replace a shorter parcel of it. It is going though Charlie Geier’s, Charlie is selling off those three (3) acre lots. I think it is going to get more complicated as time goes on. Just about every years we go out there and fix two (2), three (3), four (4) suck holes in it."
Chairman Schmierer asked, "It is a tile?"
Dirk Fleck answered, "Yeah, it is a twelve (12) may be, Brad (Surveyor Ward)?"
Surveyor Ward replied, "It is a ten (10) on the stretch that you are talking about now the biggest it gets is a ten (10) it start out as an eight (8)."
Dirk Fleck said, "Mary (Drainage Assistant Sterrett) is actually getting mean about it because it is in the red and she doesn’t like to fix those tiles. Some thing probably needs to be done about it."
Chairman Schmierer replied, "Well, we could probably raise the assessment rates by about twice and wait a couple of years until we get the money in it."
Dirk Fleck replied, "We looked at that and I think it will be twice or three. It was almost three (3) fold we were looking at. We just set up there in the office and ran the calculator on it the other day. What would have to happen to get that to Maintenance? Does it have to go through some type of hearing or….."
Chairman Schmierer said, "It is on Maintenance now is it not?"
Dirk Fleck replied, "Well, yes but to get the tile replaced. Right now it is slated to go through Reconstruction if we switch that and said we are going to do it under Maintenance."
Board Member Heimlich stated, "We would have to have a hearing to raise the Maintenance rate. The Maintenance would have to be raised for I assume three (3) or four (4) years.
Dirk Fleck replied, "Three (3) to five (5) years!"
Surveyor Ward replied, "We figured at Twelve Dollars ($12.00) we could do it in three (3) years.
Board Member Heimlich replied, "We would have to have a hearing!"
Attorney Loy asked, "It is in the red now?"
Surveyor Ward answered, "Actually it is positive, it is sitting at Three Hundred and Eighty Dollars ($380.00)."
Dirk Fleck replied, "It will be in the red as soon as they fix the repairs out there."
Board Member Heimlich asked, "What does it bring in a year?"
Surveyor Ward answered, "It brings in Two Thousand Dollars ($2,000.00) a year."
Dirk Fleck stated, "Just to speed up the process I would like to know if it can be switched over to Maintenance side."
Chairman Schmierer replied, "It can be done, there is no reason why it can’t be done."
Dirk Fleck replied, "I think it would be quicker because I would like to see it done now in Brad’s (Surveyor Ward) term."
Chairman Schmierer replied, "If Brad (Surveyor Ward) goes over and gets a proposed Maintenance contract. Have him sign it today, bring it to the next meeting and we will approve it on the Maintenance. We will get started on it."
Board Member Heimlich asked, "What will we be replacing?"
Surveyor Ward replied, "About Twenty-five Hundred (2,500) feet. (Looking at a computer generated map) It starts about right here and you can barely see it on here but there is kind of a dark line through here. It run through these people’s yard it looks like to about this point. There is an other one that comes in this way."
Chairman Schmierer asked, "Is that out there off Three Hundred (300)?
Dirk Fleck answered, "Yeah, there seems to just be that one part that seem to be continually breaking down every year."
Board Member Heimlich asked, "Does it out let in to that ditch there?"
Surveyor Ward replied, "Side ditch or County ditch. It out lets at the north end of it some where."
Chairman Schmierer said, "We have worked on that before, we have work on the out let."
Dirk Fleck replied, "You cleaned that ditch about five (5) years ago, it was Ezra is what we found out the other day when we were looking at."
Board Member Burton asked, "Can you access the tile through those lots?"
Dirk Fleck answered, "The building that Mr. Wooten built on that farm is with in about two (2) foot."
Board Member Burton replied, "A pole building I think we remember that."
Dirk Fleck continued, "He put it right there at the edge of it so I am assuming we will just have to work around that."
Board Member Burton said, "I think I mention that in my notes."
Surveyor Ward replied, "I think it would be basically from this point some where in this neighbor- hood to this arrow right here."
Chairman Schmierer asked, "You got what about a half (1/2) mile?"
Surveyor Ward replied, "About Twenty-five Hundred ( 2,500) feet."
Board Member Heimlich asked, "That is the only building that there is a problem with?"
Surveyor Ward continued, "I think up here on the north end it kind of goes around this lot, takes off this way a little bit and comes down."
Dirk Fleck replied, "There is just that one building and I assume we can just skirt around that if we are putting in new tile. We will just go beside it and go through that guy’s yard, through a pasture and through a couple of fences. I talked to Jim (Wooten) about it the other day; he would like to see it done there is a suck hole right in his yard right now. Of course after he realizes that the assessments have gone up we may have a different story. I didn’t bring that part in, that is you guy’s job there. That it actually cost him to do that. I will leave that up to you. He is assuming some one else is paying for it."
Chairman Schmierer asked, "Has Hallar got any property there?"
Dirk Fleck replied, "I think we are safe there….. Any how that is my proposal if that can be done I would like to see it."
Chairman Schmierer stated, "I don’t see why he can’t, do you? Just sign a Maintenance contract-proposal, bring to us and we will approve it. Then we can get started on it. You will have to shoot some levels."
Dirk Fleck said, "Thanks for you time."
Chairman Schmierer asked what else Surveyor Ward had for the Drainage Board.
Surveyor Ward replied, "I didn’t put it on the agenda but I have estimates on the Riffle Ditch up here north east of town. I am guessing about Thirty-seven Hundred Dollar ($3,700.00) to do the project."
Chairman Schmierer asked, "What did you say was in that project?"
Board Member Burton asked, "Taking the brush off?" Go up Thirty-nine (39) on the east side?"
Surveyor Ward replied, "About Five Hundred (500) feet…..on the west side of Thirty-nine (39). There is about Forty-eight Hundred Dollars ($4,800.00) in the fund right now."
Board Member Burton replied, "Is that the one we talked about that the biggest obstacle is access?"
Surveyor Ward continued, "The petition, the owner of that property never signed the petition."
Chairman Schmierer replied, "We still have right of way going. Who is the owner of the property?"
Surveyor Ward answered, "Kenny Wrede and ……."
Chairman Schmierer replied, "That is all right! You will just clean one side of the ditch any way."
Surveyor Ward replied, "Yeah! Clear the north side, dip it and dip the out let a little better."
Chairman Schmierer stated, "Get some quotes on it, and ask for three (3) or four (4) quotes would you say George (Attorney Loy)?"
Attorney Loy replied, "At least three (3)!"
Surveyor Ward continued, "Then on the Westfall I have an estimate on that. That is one up towards Monon that we have been working on. I think it will be about Twelve Thousand Dollars ($12,000.00) to do the project and there is about Six Thousand ($6,000.00) in the account. It brings in about Two Thousand Dollars a year."
Chairman Schmierer said, "Have a hearing on it then and raise the maintenance for at least three years to pay for it."
Surveyor Ward replied, "Ok, we will get that set up."
Chairman Schmierer replied, "Ok! That is the only way we can do it then."
Board Member Heimlich asked, "Is that the Errol Westfall?"
Surveyor Ward answered, "Yeah, about Fifty-three Hundred (5,300) feet of it needs cleaned. Then it starts to run in to the natural water way. I suppose that is the Big Monon that it eventually runs in to, actually I think it runs in to the McKillip but it is real close to where it out lets in to a body of water. Not a ditch!"
Chairman Schmierer asked if any one had any thing else for the Drainage Board. No response from the audience.
Chairman Schmierer adjourned the April 4th, 2011 White County Drainage Board Meeting.